Country of origin: eritrea
Year of settlement: 1992
Age on arrival:
City: turin
Gender: female
Language of the interview: Italian
[i] Hi [name].
[r] Hi.
[i] Would you like to introduce yourself and tell us who you are?
[r] Ok, fine. My name is [name], I live in Turin, I’m a law student, I was born in Italy, in Turin to be precise, I’m half Eritrean and half Ethiopian. And what about me, I don’t know where…
[i] Half and half because your parents are one from Eritrea and the other from Ethiopia?
[r] Yes, that’s right, my mum is from Eritrea and my dad is Ethiopian. I’m 26 years old, in general, I don’t know what to say.
[i] So, do you want to talk about this connection you have with the two countries: Eritrea and Ethiopia?
[r] Yes, well, the bond with my origins is very strong on my mum’s side. Well, the bond with my origins is very strong on my mum’s side because I grew up with her and so maybe the various customs, even the language is much more familiar to me than on my dad’s side. I don’t know much, because I was born and grew up with my mother. But let’s say that Eritrean and Ethiopian cultures are very similar, apart from a few aspects, they are more or less similar. But anyway, let’s say that my bond with Eritrea is very nostalgic in the sense that it’s a land I’ve never seen, but it’s as if I’d somehow got to know it through my mum. But there’s always the dream of going and discovering something more, even if obviously, let’s say that I’ve been here longer and I know Italian culture more than that of my country of origin.
[i] And your mum? Because you said ‘I have a very strong bond, because my mum taught me anyway she passed it on to me’ can you give us an example of how your mum made you learn this part?
[r] First of all at the various festivals, we celebrate Christmas, not on the 25th of December, and since we are also Orthodox the calendar is different, maybe we do celebrate on the 25th of December because we were born here, but at the same time we celebrate our own Christmas, well, I think, a few weeks later it falls and so we eat, we still eat, even now, we usually do the typical dishes, if they gather all the relatives, and we practise the same customs as when my mum was down there, so she really still practises these traditions. Or even tigrino coffee, coffee on Sundays when all the relatives get together and if it’s made on the ground, traditionally if it’s made on the ground, my aunts and my mother spend hours and hours talking while they make the coffee, or at least they cook it, they grind it, it’s a very long preparation, I mean now talking about it like this I’m making up the story. And then it’s a very convivial moment, in short, if you drink coffee but at the same time you eat, you celebrate in quotation marks and you are all together as a family. And it’s a very, very strong moment, it’s a beautiful moment.
[i] So let’s say in everyday life you have somehow adopted the important moments and made them your own?
[r] Yes, yes.
[i] But what about the language? The Tigrinya language?
[r] I understand the language, if I hear someone speaking, I understand it, something of it has remained with me and above all, in these moments of reunion with relatives, they always speak Tigrinya, so … But I don’t know how to speak it, I can say a few words, a few little phrases, but I don’t know how to speak it. Because, when we were little, my mum would speak to us in Tigrinya, when we came back from school, both my brother and I, otherwise you can’t understand. But going to school for 8 hours anyway, and then also doing recreational activities after school, always speaking Italian, it gradually decreased a bit, no, because we got confused anyway, we were a bit lost, let’s say. So, my mum was advised to speak to him in Italian. For I don’t know what reason.
[i] So you have a brother?
[r] Yes, I have an older brother
[i] And does he also take part in this ritual, so to speak, in everyday life?
[r] Yes, especially now that he’s left home, he lives alone with his girlfriend. When… it’s also an excuse to see each other a little more, he too has always lived and lives these moments. And then something else I forgot is the clothing, which is important, because when there are these celebrations you have to dress properly, right?
[i] What does ‘in style’ mean?
[r] It means that the traditional Eritrean dress, this white dress, there are these long white linen dresses, with all different colours, they are all hand-embroidered. I’ve always wondered how in Eritrea it must be at least 30 degrees, spring-like temperatures in autumn and in summer we reach 40 degrees, how they manage with linen, which is a rather heavy fabric, yet they dress like that and even cover their heads. And then if they wear all these gold rings and necklaces, because it’s a custom, even if we reiterate that Eritrea is a very poor country, when it’s time to celebrate you have to show off everything you have. Maybe it’s just two gold necklaces, but you have to show them off a little, a bit like in other countries too, now I don’t know …
[i] And do you have your traditional dress?
[r] I don’t have my own, but I use my mum’s, one of many of my mum’s, and I like it because I feel more at home, I don’t know how to explain it to you, it doesn’t usually feel like home.
[i] You said something very special. You were born here, weren’t you?
[r] Yes
[i] And in your speech you often used to say ‘my culture, my country and I feel at home’, now, referring to Eritrea, a country that in fact you haven’t seen, so this great love has really been transmitted to you. Why don’t you feel at home, instead, here where you were born?
[r] Good question. Maybe I don’t feel at home, I’ve never felt at home, because without wanting to hide the fact I’m a different person, at least I don’t think they’ve understood what this ‘different’ is because we’re all different, in different ways but we’re different. I’ll be honest, I don’t want to start with a blatant racist episode. But I’ve always felt latent racism since I was a child. And so this latent racism, shall we say? Like to say, sometimes we say ‘I’m Italian’, right? ‘No, you’re not Italian’, maybe with other people I didn’t know very well, right? When I introduced myself at the end you’re black, how can you be Italian. I also heard these things, right. So, at a certain point I stopped saying that I was Italian. If you want I escaped, I was born here but nothing important, you know… But I’m sorry because once I had a very, very strong bond with Italy and on the other hand I had a strong bond with my origins, no, this love that I was passed down the traditions from my mother and these two things went in parallel, they moved in parallel and then at a certain point growing up, I felt different, even though, I repeat, I was never the victim of blatant bullying, of bullying, all right, let’s say that if it can be defined as bullying. Of racism, even if, I repeat, I was very lucky at the same time because I met many people who never confronted this diversity in me. I have many Italian friends and few foreign friends, because, here too we need to emphasise something else, which is that you never say that you are discriminated against by one side, that is by the Italians, but you are also discriminated against by the other side, because when you adapt anyway, you were born in Italy, attending schools in Italy. It’s normal that the majority of the people you meet are of Italian nationality, so with white skin, right? And it’s not like you do it on purpose, especially me, I was born in ‘92, the phenomenon of immigration wasn’t as striking as it is today, when a class is populated more by foreigners than Italians. And so, as a result, I have more friends, if not all of Italian nationality, and I have few friends from Eritrea, if they’re not my cousins or distant relatives, or of other nationalities. But why is there this phenomenon we were talking about, the ghetto mentality, that if you’re not with us you seem to be racist? Because I’ve heard it, I have to say, and on top of everything else I’ve also heard that I’m a racist because I always hung out with white people, even if it’s ugly to talk about it in these terms.
[i] Who told you that?
[r] Some of the guys who study in the study room …
[i] Are they guys of Eritrean origin?
[r] They are not of Eritrean origin, African I was told so because I didn’t hang out with them. I don’t hang out with them because I don’t know you, I hang out with everyone, I don’t see colour, imagine that. On the other hand, to finish the conversation because I am very long-winded because when I speak I have to talk about 2000 things, I never get to the point. I don’t feel Italian because they don’t make me feel that way. In the sense that the more I go out the more I feel the heaviness which is not a burden for me, on the contrary. Diversity is a richness, I always put the quotes around it, diversity. And they don’t make me feel that way, let’s say I still can’t feel that I will feel Italian the moment when no one has to specify certain things, in the sense that it seems normal to you that that person is Italian because they were born in Italy and they are Italian, but unfortunately that is something that I hope will be cured by time, let’s say so, I hope
[i] Well listen instead I’m asking you are you a law student?
[r] Yes.
[i] Why did you choose to study law?
[r] This choice was a very difficult one, in the sense that it’s not like I really wanted to study when I was little, to tell the truth, and I wasn’t even this model student, I was very excitable, but not that I didn’t like studying, I just wasn’t consistent, that’s the right word. And so it was a very difficult choice because, as you know, you have to study a lot for law, it’s the truth. But I really liked law, I like it because, why not, because I already speak it, I liked it, I said it in the past tense, no, I still like it a lot. I also really like the fact that it’s so hard, we have our own language, which is something. And then because, since I was little, I’ve always been a bit of a champion of justice, no, who’s always ‘it’s not fair’, always pointing the finger somewhere. I’ve always had this critical side. And then in high school, having studied law for the first two years, I fell in love with it right away. I said this is maybe the thing I’d like to do in life. And then, above all for my history, for many reasons, I would like to defend those in need, those who need help, especially immigrants, if I have to be honest, especially them. And as a ‘I owe you’, because I had an immigrant mother and one of many dreams, let’s say.
[i] Did your mum arrive here a long time ago?
[r] Yes, 40 years ago. 40 years ago she came here as a young girl, she was 18/19 years old, and she was very brave, because honestly, I mean, she left when she was 19 for a foreign country, totally, because she didn’t say ‘I’m going to London’, which is still a European country, more or less the culture is the same. Instead, going to a country where she didn’t know the culture, didn’t even know the climate, because my mum, the thing she told me when I arrived in Italy, she had arrived as she had left, in the sense, short sleeves, I won’t say shorts because I don’t know, actually. It was January, more or less it was January when she arrived even though she was in Rome, it’s not so hot here. To understand how inexperienced she was, if she was thrown into an experience that even she didn’t know,
[i] Did she tell you what it was like in the early days of her arrival here in Italy?
[r] Yes, she always tells me so I can understand how lucky I am. Making the most of what I have. Yes, she told me that she knew the language, because she knew it well down there, but relatively speaking, like I know Tigrinya, let’s talk about it for a moment. But she really struggled, then okay, she was also very attached to her brother who had been here for some time, so she also had this hook, so to speak. But she felt it much more than I feel discrimination, especially in those days when Italians couldn’t stand each other, let alone ‘negroes’ (in inverted commas), so it was tough, it was hard, but gradually, over time… … well, my mum is a tough cookie, I mean, in general Africans, especially Eritreans, are very proud. You can’t say anything to them. In fact, when my mum and I argue or I say something to her, she doesn’t talk to me for 2 months because that’s how she is. But, you know, just to make you understand how proud she is.
[i] How integrated is she? How did she do it? What did she feel at the beginning? As soon as we arrived, did she tell us how her journey was?
[r] Yes, she told me that she started out working as a domestic, for families, because it was much more common back then. However, even there, through acquaintances, she worked 7 days a week, let’s say … But in all of this she found families who helped her, they helped her a lot. So I dissociate myself from those who say that Italians are racist, it’s not true that Italians are racist. Let’s say that a percentage of people who are not that way are actually very nice. But there are others who drag us down, so let’s say we put them together and you get a good number, especially in this historical period. But we will survive this too.
[i] But going back to your mum, you told me that she arrived here in Italy when she was very young and she told you everything about her childhood?
[r] In Eritrea?
[i] Yes
[r] Yes, in Eritrea she…
[i] Also in the fact that you somehow knew Italian before you arrived here, why is that?
[r] Because they teach it in Eritrea, in the sense that they also teach it because we know that it was an Italian colony, even if many people don’t know it, and when they ask where you’re from, where are your origins, I say Eritrea, they say ‘Eritrea? Where is Eritrea?’ And also the history is that Eritrea, Ethiopia and Somalia were Italian colonies. And above all in Eritrea schools were founded that are called ‘Italian schools’ and they still exist today. They have the same programmes, obviously they teach the mother tongue and their language but they also teach Italian. And more or less they have the same programmes as here.
[i] So your mum learned Italian there?
[r] Yes, at school, but just a little. But many people come from Eritrea anyway, they speak a little Italian, maybe not very well, but they still speak it. And then also the notices are written in Italian in Eritrea, yes yes there is half and half. I have never seen it, unfortunately, but I have heard about it from my mum’s relatives. And then I also check on the internet, I go to see the place, the videos, yes, yes. It’s right to get to know my world, one day I will go there.
[i] Would you like to go there?
[r] Yes, very much, it’s one of my secret dreams. To go to my motherland, my origin, to get off the plane and kiss the ground, things like that. But I’d like to do it before I die, it’s one of my dreams
[i] Where is your mother originally from?
[r] Asmara, the capital city
[i] And as a young law student, how do you see yourself?
[r] I thought my mum
[i] Yes, you. How do you see your future? Do you think you’ll live here in Italy? Would you like that? How do you see it?
[r] Well, personally I go through phases, some days I say enough is enough, I’m leaving this country, I’m going to go where I can feel more fulfilled. Then most of the time I say, no, I want to stay here, and I want to help people here. I mean, not going who knows where in the world. So, I see my future here, at least I’ll take the risk, maybe at least I’ll have tried. I see it here, I don’t want to leave.
[i] Do you like travelling?
[r] Yes, very much.
[i] Have you had any opportunities to travel?
[r] Yes, I have aunts in London so I often go and visit them. Then I went to Spain on holiday. I’ve been to France a bit, and I’ve travelled around Europe, let’s say, but I’ve never been outside of Europe. Because if I had to go outside of Europe, the first stop would be Eritrea. And then after… but first Eritrea, Ethiopia.
[i] Would you like to?
[r] Yes, very much.
[i] Apart from Italian and your mother tongue Tigrinya, do you know any other languages?
[r] School English, in the sense that I speak it and can get by with it, but I’m not fluent. However, I get by quite well with English. A little French and Spanish. Although I’d like to improve my knowledge of the other two languages, as I’d like to learn more. And my own, of course, to perfect it.
[i] What about the two languages?
[r] No, I mean French and Spanish, I’m a bit like that but I get by. [I} Good. Is there anything you want to tell us, anything you want to share, any point of view?
[r] Actually yes, I would like people to realise that when a person leaves their country, they never do it for fun. And above all for the people who are running away right now let’s talk about the Horn of Africa in question, where there are terrible situations, where people may not be starving to death because they are not starving to death. These people are sick and desperate. Because I would challenge anyone to leave a dictatorial regime, because that is what they have. And so we can’t just hide and cross the Sudanese desert. And then, if you make it, to arrive in Libya, still alive, because in the desert even the Bedouins can catch you. And kill you and then take your organs for the black market, that’s the truth. And then in Libya we all know what happens, I don’t need to go into detail. And then to arrive in Italy and still feel rejected is not right. Because it could have been me, it could have been the Italians themselves in that situation. Instead we were born in the right part of the world, I repeat the words that are heard and so on. And so we should understand these people, rather than criticise them. We should focus on other issues, with other people who are not them. So we should open our hearts and above all our minds before speaking, I want to emphasise this.
[i] Does the immigration issue bother you?
[r] Yes, very much, especially because I feel powerless in the face of all this. And I don’t want to be indifferent, even if you know that in everyday life you are busy with your own things, you don’t pay attention to it, but I honestly cannot forget the people who died in the Mediterranean Sea. Even if they are not my relatives, I cannot forget them. I remember the desperation, the images of those graves of people who… especially an image that I will never forget. It’s that of a girl whose origin I don’t know, because it was just such a blurred image, the image of this girl crying desperately on her boyfriend’s grave. Maybe they wanted to create a future together, I don’t know, but I thought it wasn’t right. Even if I didn’t know them, that is, they’re nothing to me, but they’re human beings and it’s not right that all of us, I mean all of us, can turn the other cheek. Because apart from the few people who take care of them, we can look the other way. And to think that it’s normal for people to die at sea is not normal, just as wars are never normal. Death cannot be a habit. No, I cannot accept this.
[i] Thank you very much
[r] You’re welcome.