SU_B_27

[i] Hello Mr. [Name], Here we are in the office of the Bosangani e.V. association, we have the project from Museum [Colliery] Hanover in Bochum. Today we welcomed our friend [name]. He lives in Velbert and he wants to talk to us about his experience in this region, about his life in Germany and also about the country of Congo. So I ask Mr. [Name] to be on behalf of the people, who will follow him through this video.
[r] Hello President [name], for welcoming me to your office here, and more precisely in the Bosangani club. That’s why I’m here so that we can talk as agreed.
[i] Thank you very much. I’m going to ask you how it came about that you you landed in the town of Velbert. When you came, where were you? First, can you tell us where you came from? How did you come to Velbert and why Velbert?
[r] Definitely, I am Congolese. The circumstances of the country are as they are. There is no change, you tried to achieve something, but it doesn’t work. Today the Congolese are scattered everywhere, almost all over the world. You will find Congolese in all countries. Because the country is not developing. We are born with suffering, we grew up with suffering. We have become accustomed to this suffering, because we have no choice, but later If we are killed, we will be tortured, regardless of whether you did something or not. We become slaves. So that’s why when you see that there’s an opportunity, you have to run. So you can try to leave the country. Because in our country we are considered foreigners. If you want to do something, you will be arrested. If you want to do something, you will be killed. If you want to do something, you will be beaten. If you want to do something, it’s always wrong. There is no work. Only difficulties. People die Day and night, morning, that is […] hunger also comes into play. Therefore, on one occasion the Congolese will leave the country. So that they try to move forward. Because it is very difficult in our country Congo. As we hear, since we were born, that Congo is the richest country, but I don’t know. I don’t believe that myself, that this country is rich. Because of the wealth of the country should be of benefit to the people [phone rings]. But we have the wealth of the country only ever be of use to their owners. But it’s not possible. [Telephone rings]
[i] You said that there were difficulties in your country. When you were in Congo, what city did you live in? And in which municipality?
[r] So I was in the capital, in the city Kinshasa, I was also born in Kinshasa. I was in the capital, I was in Ndjili commune. Then I was in Ngiri Ngiri commune, where I rented an apartment. So, it’s really like that, I I come from the interior of Kinshasa.
[i] You probably had friends in your childhood, who grew up with you. Do you still have contact with them? til today? Do you still have souvenirs from your childhood to this day? where did you grow up? Do you still have contact with friends from back then?
[i] But, the problem is, that every person who was at school with me, from 1st grade to 6th grade of elementary school, I still can’t forget that to this day. Every acquaintance woman or man, everyone who was at school with me first grade to university, where I stopped studying, I can’t forget anyone. There are also some good deeds that we had done to each other in childhood, there are also friends with whom we had quarreled, there was no good understanding then. There were also friends with whom understanding was very good. There were friends whose family I went to. That’s how it was. If someone says that he has forgotten friends he grew up with, then that means that he doesn’t come from this country. He himself knows where he comes from and where he left his friends. But if you are one of the people of this country, no matter where you come from, then you must know your friends or your relatives who grew up with you.
[i] Let’s talk more about Germany. When you arrived in Germany, which city did you end up in before coming to Velbert?
[r] When I came to Germany, I ended up within Germany. I landed in an airport within Germany. Then I went to Unna, where I introduced myself. I was welcomed in Unna and stayed in Unna for about two months. I left the city of Unna, then I was assigned to the city of Willich. The city is close to the border of Belgium. I stayed there for three months. When I left the town, I came to the town of Velbert. I’ve been in Velbert for about two years.
[i] What impression do you have of the city of Velbert, the people who are there, did you like them, did they welcome you well?
[r] So, every country you go to, you have to dance with the leg that the people there dance with. [Proverb from Congo: You have to adapt]. It’s not the case if the people there dance with their left leg and you dance with your right. And if the people there dance with their right leg, and you dance with your left. That’s not the case. In order for you to get used to it, so that you can like something, you have to learn how others do it. You’ll get used to it over time. I like the city where I live. There is no disturbance, Since I have been in this country, I have never been insulted. If you show people respect, people will show respect to you. I’ve never argued with anyone. Here it is usually the case that everyone is at home, When you return from your job, you stay at home. It’s not common to go to other people’s homes often. Unless you have an appointment with a colleague. They can meet there and get things done, otherwise not. For example, in our city, he is rarely a problem with anyone have. There are also people who have problems when you provoke people. If you are interested in other people’s lives. But I, really, When I get home from work, I go home straight away. If I have an appointment, I have to keep it. Sometimes I go to the Bosangani for the meeting and then I go back home. I don’t see anything that bothers me in this city. It’s a very good city. She is very calm.
[i] Besides your city, how do you find the population of other cities in your region, such as Dortmund, Bochum, Essen. How do you view this population? How was your reception? What difference do you notice when comparing with the population of Velbert and also for comparison with the population of Kinshasa?
[r] So, definitely, you see, here we are in Europe. There are people who say that Europeans are real children of God. Because the Europeans organized everything here. I can give an example: Today in Africa, like in the Congo, where there are many difficulties, you can go out, either to visit people, or to visit people. But the people there have no way to buy a drink for you. If they offer you a drink that means they took someone’s money had borrowed it or had been preparing for your visit for a long time and they had already reserved this drink for you. But that’s not the case here. What is disturbing in the Congo is that social life doesn’t exist. If there is no good school, if there are no good hospitals, then there is no work. So what will the social life be like? But here the European organized everything, the Europeans organized everything. Today you can go to an apartment, the man doesn’t work, but he has food at home. He has water at home, he has drinks, he has wine, sweet drinks. When someone comes, he immediately offers the drinks instead of going shopping. Who has these at home, why? Because the Europeans have already organized everything. Social life is already guaranteed. That’s why many Africans are fleeing their countries. Because it is very difficult. Today the same Europeans are destroying the continent of Africa. If the same Europeans see that Africans are disturbing their countries, well they can […] Europeans are the ones destroying Africa. It would be best if you organized Africa. You should give good conditions to the presidents you hire there because today the people will elect their president. You, Europeans, don’t want this president, they put whoever they want. This is disturbing our countries. If the population refuses, they will be shot, then they will be beaten. They are imprisoned even though they are innocent. If you see that she the Africans don’t want to be here anymore then they should organize Africa. When the people elect a president, they should leave the popularly elected president. In addition, they have democracy here, In Africa we always hear about democracy, but there is no democracy. Why? Here, when a president’s mandate is over, he quietly leaves. But for us, when the mandate is over, the same Europeans are behind him. They give him weapons, they make him stubborn, they force him to continue to rule. Why are you, Europeans, putting a president in power today? Except this president, when he leaves power, after his mandate of five years, then they can’t work with a new president? There must be only him in power for thirty to forty years. Does the land belong to him? That’s why I say again that the European organized everything here, that’s why […] Never. Even South Africa will not be the same as Europe. It’s just hard. Because the European organized everything. There is social life, there are hospitals. If you get sick, you will be cared for. You don’t need one Family members so that someone can take care of them. They will give you medication. The city paid for everything. But we in the Congo, if you just have a fever, If you don’t have aspirin, you die. It’s very difficult.
[i] Thank you very much, I want to know, when you arrived in Germany, what difficulties did you have? [Telephone rings] We know that when someone comes to Germany, they have problems with the language, problems with the contacts, problem with the information, […] What can you say about it?
[r] Ah, in any case it is very difficult because you see it’s good if you’re in the country where it is tried to know the language spoken there. But when I came to this country, the difficulties I had encountered were not due to hunger, but there were difficulties with understanding. I could be told, “Go to this room to have tests done.” But everything is said in German and you don’t understand it. Everyone who was there didn’t understand it because we were all new. Who could help you? We often received help from security guards. There were Moroccans who worked as security guards and they sometimes helped us. Some spoke French. They had lived in Germany for a long time and they spoke to us in French. Then we understood and we were able to understand what was being asked of us. But if no one was there to interpret, then we really had big difficulties. The problem of language is […] But if you have hope for something, you will know it. But what gave us difficulty was the language. Although we pitched, but There is no one who can speak this language from beginning to end. Because if you are a foreigner and you are already an adult, then it is difficult to learn anything. It’s hard to know everything. The main thing is to express yourself so that people understand you. That’s the way it is.
[i] What did you do to be able to talk to people? Did you express yourself in French? Besides French, what other language did you use or what means did you use, so you can get the information you need?
[r] Ah! So definitely, In such situations God gives other wisdom. If you want to do something or go somewhere and you cannot express yourself, then you are like a mute. Because you don’t know where to start with the language and where to stop. You can’t find the person who can help you by translating into French. So there were really big difficulties. So definitely there was difficulty. Luckily, since the European organized everything […] At the time when I was new, when we left this place, we went straight to […] to […] went to the camp where we were assigned. There were lessons there. There were classes, everyone had to take part, but there were also [those] who didn’t want to go to class. If you have the will to do the thing, then you have to accept it. At the beginning we learned, but the language of this country is very difficult. You can even spend eight months on the course without understanding anything. Over time, if you listen to [them] every day, you will later master the language. It was like that. Today, when I try to understand and speak, it is because of the lessons. The lessons are only taught in German, he doesn’t speak French. From beginning to end he only speaks in German, it’s difficult to understand. So you have to be creative, if you’re not creative you’re in trouble. But if you have the will, you will know the language. I know that many people have left this country because of the language. They surrendered until they realized they couldn’t speak the language, then they fled. But if you have the will to do it, it will be something. How we stayed. At the beginning we couldn’t do it, but today I can understand and answer questions. That is the will of God.
[i] Thank you very much! Can you describe your district of Velbert where you live? Surely you know the city of Velbert, can you describe it?
[r] The city of Velbert […] I can say that the larger city near us is the city of Essen. Because I today can say, that I was in Ndjili, and exactly in the district one. But for a stranger “Quarter One” will present a difficulty. But if they tell her that I was on the boulevard that leads to the airport, then the person understands it better. It’s the same with us about the city of Velbert. Because the country is big. The city of Velbert […] Because in the Congo, when you talk about the city, it means the city center of Kinshasa, where you can also find the main market and the town hall. But here is the city like a commune. Where we live is a city. But our big city is food. There are people if you talk to them and when he asks you where you live. If you answer Velbert, then he doesn’t know where Velbert is. On the other hand, if you say that I live near Essen, he will understand immediately. If you tell someone that our nearest city is Essen, he will understand it immediately. Then he will ask for the bus. Then you can explain to him where he should take the bus and that the bus will drive thirty minutes to get to us. This is the reference. Our big city is Essen. Our cities are like […], like […] So all of the small towns in which our city is located, the city of Essen is the big city nearby. It is like that.
[r] Thank you very much. You came from the Congo, specifically from the Ndjili commune, then you were in the Makala commune. You grew up there. Do you have a souvenir that you took with you when you you fled your country? Do you have a souvenir you took with you? It could be a photo, anything. Something that reminds you of your country.
[r] Keepsake! Like a photo […]
[i] It could also be music or something when you fled. Something you took with you.
[r] For me as a souvenir is only the protection from God with which I was able to come here. If I said that I took a photo or money as a souvenir, then that was simply not possible. Many wanted to come here. They had money but they couldn’t come. Many sought money to come here. But didn’t get any money. Many have faced various difficulties, in some cases, they demand that he leave the country, if he always stays in the country then he will be killed by the government. But he doesn’t know where to go. Ultimately, these people are arrested and killed. For me, the best souvenir I can name here, what I brought with me, that is God. I came with God. Because he is the one who protected me from the problems I had in my homeland in order to come here.
[i] If we have to make a comparison between the foods and customs from here versus those from your homeland when you came here, did you also find the food from your homeland here? Or the customs from there, did you find them here too? Or do you miss the food and customs or culture of your homeland?
[r] So Europeans are flexible, Europeans know people’s needs. If the European often eats spaghetti, he will not force them to eat spaghetti. There are various supermarkets here, if you want to eat food from the Europeans, then you can go to the supermarkets and buy food from Europe. If you want to eat our food from Congo, there are also shops that sell African food. You can eat according to your taste. If you want to eat “Mfumbua” or want to eat mushrooms, or want to eat “wangila”, or anything. Everything is there, it only depends on you. Because the European cannot force you to eat what only he eats. He has allowed the import of food, food from Africa is being imported. What you want to eat, what you ate in the Congo, you can find here. The prices, if you compare, are more expensive in Congo than here. Here, on the other hand, the goods are cheaper. That amazed me.
[i] Where do you buy food from Congo? Do you have to go far away or do you just buy this in your city? Can you name places where you buy the groceries? Can you also explain how you get these foods?
[r] I often shop in Wuppertal because Wuppertal is close to Velbert. I also shop in Essen. Essen is the big city near us. I can also shop in Bochum, where I am right now. I can also shop in Dortmund. That depends on the situation. If I have to do something in Dortmund, I can Take the opportunity to do some shopping there too. When I have an appointment in Bochum, I will shop in Bochum. If it has to be in Essen, I will shop in Essen. That depends the situation. But if I just want to go shopping without having any other appointments, then I prefer to shop in Essen or Wuppertal. But more often in food, because it’s in food There are many more African shops compared to Wuppertal. But there is everything, you can even buy kola nuts here. So there is everything. Also some roots, I’m amazed. When someone says that they are in Europe eating food from the Congo doesn’t find it, that’s not right. You can find almost everything here.
[i] We can say that you are not homesick from this point of view. Or are you homesick because you are far away from your country?
[r] Homesickness in what sense?
[i] To think of your country, to think about the other things the ones you could eat, but that are missing, or the type of cooking that is missing?
[r] Definitely, When I have to think, I think to the relatives who stayed, the children who remained the parents who stayed the friends who stayed the pastors, who preached to me. They stayed. I think about that a lot. We ask God often to give us, so that we can help the people who stayed there. To help pastors, to support God’s work, as we were used to. Many friends call me and ask for help. If we have something, we’ll send it. I think of her. God should give us the strength he should give us that Opportunities to give us the people who stayed there are able to support, as the Bible says, the strong support the weak. It is like that.
[i] We are always wavering between Germany and the Congo. Let’s talk about your homeland again. The relatives who stayed there are you thinking about her? The family I mean, the immediate family with dad, mom and you children? Are they still there or not? If there are still some relatives there, what are the contacts like or how do you maintain the contacts? Do you have contacts with them?
[r] It might have been harder before. But today the Europeans made everything easy. It may be that the relatives are not in the social network [in the sense of social media? ], but you have contact with family members through friends. You can send a friend to family members and talk to family members through him. When you hear them, the stress is overcome.
[i] Are you speaking through the telephone?
[r] We speak through the telephone.
[i] We return to Germany. If you want to spend your free time somehow or let’s just ask: How is your day going? When you get up, how do you spend your day, your normal day?
[r] Here are Monday to Friday for work or school.
[i] And how do you spend your day, do you go to school or where?
[r] At this moment, the problem in this country is that you can look for work and you can also find work, the work is there, you don’t have to look much, but the problem is, that in the work we know, since I am a driver and car mechanic. I drive a truck I can drive a forklift, an elevator. So our work requires mastery of the language. That’s why I can say that I can work, it’s not a problem. But as the people at town hall advised me, should I deal with the language first. I shouldn’t rush to start work because Our work requires a good knowledge of the language. I can work as a driver, as a car mechanic, as a forklift driver. All of this requires knowledge of the language. So for me, I saw that it was necessary to start with the language first. I can start doing any work, but it’s better that I work in the profession I learned. This is much better. That’s why I decided to learn the language first. When I get up tomorrow morning, I’ll go to school, I leave the apartment at six o’clock. School starts at eight o’clock. I go to school by bus. It takes me an hour and a half to reach school. I’ll be at school exactly at eight five. If you miss the bus, you will be late for school. If you’re late at school, you have to give an explanation. You have to say why you came later. If you were also absent from school, you must also give an explanation. That’s why you have to have a proper explanation. On Monday I leave the house at 6:30 a.m. and then I come back at 6:30 p.m. From Monday to Friday. On Saturday, when I have an appointment. Like today, you invited me. If I don’t have an appointment, I spend my day at home. I stay at home almost all day. Because it is open Monday to Friday from 6:30 a.m. to 6:30 p.m. therefore on Saturday, You have to sleep until 12 o’clock and then stay at home. You can also stay at home on Sunday. Unless, that you get visitors. I can visit sometimes. Someone can call me and invite me, I can go there. But only for a short time so I have the time can to return home and rest.
[i] Do you have contacts with other Congolese in Velbert, where you live, or what?
[i] When I came to this city, I stayed a year, I hadn’t seen anyone who spoke Lingala. This city, so, I didn’t see any Congolese. But a surprise, I met a friend who was with me was in the same district as me I worked in a workshop in the field of auto mechanics, in Victoire [street and district]. Vieux Sancho and Grand Brother Lusala in Victoire. Some people can recognize these people by the name. It’s on Avenu Shabe on the corner. Vieux Sacho and Grand Brother Vieux Lusala. How did I meet my boyfriend? Where we lived, our apartment was small. They had to give me a big apartment. I was then given an apartment in a place where I met my friend who had worked in the same workshop with me. He has lived here for 28 years. I was amazed. When he came here, he let us into the workshop. Except him […] we are on the same street. Except him […] I met someone else His name is Philippe and he lived in the Ngiri Ngiri commune. I met him through my friend, and through this friend I got to know the old Mani. He lives in our city, but a little further away from us. There were about four Congolese people living in our town, so in the whole town. You can travel with the whole municipality of Kasa Vubu [commune from Kinshasa] or the Ngiri Ngiri commune or the entire Lemba commune, only four Congolese. There are no other Congolese, if you talk about another Congolese then it is not true. Because when a Congolese comes to town, you have to know that.
[i] Thank you, you worked in a workshop with your friend. In which municipality was this workshop located and when did you work there? What souvenir do you still have from this workshop?
[r] So the workshop was in Victoire, on the corner of Shaba, the workshop belonged to Maitre Sacho and Vieux Lusala. We called him Grand Frère [big brother], but his name was Lusala.
[i] What souvenir do you have from the time you worked in this workshop when you were a child?
[r] My souvenir is my work, I have a job, I have a souvenir, I have a good souvenir in my head. I learned my trade in this workshop, I learned to drive there. When I drive a truck today, I didn’t learn that in the workshop, but I learned to be a car mechanic in this workshop. I learned to drive a car in this workshop and with my own initiative I learned to drive a truck. I can drive 20 to 30 ton trucks. I also taught people how to drive trucks. Today some have become truck drivers. Many were driver assistants and then became truck drivers. Many are still in Africa. This is the best souvenir for me, this workshop in Victoire.
[i] You said that you are now taking a language course, how do you find the German language when you compare it to the French language? What is this language like? Many people talk about this language, you are lucky to be exposed to this language, to take part in a German language course, so that you learn this language, you have the Germans and their language heard at school and on the street. How do you find them?
[r] Ah, […] it’s hard, you see, you can’t compare this with French at all, there is no smell of the French language in the German language. French has many similarities with the Portuguese language. The Portuguese language is called the poorly spoken French language. But the German language the German language, in any case it is a bit similar to English. That’s why Nigerians have greater ease in learning this language. Because the German language is spoken similarly to the English language. So anyone who comes from an English-speaking country will have an easy time here to master the language from here. But anyone who comes from a French-speaking country will only master the language here if they have the will to do so, because it is very difficult. So the French language and the German language are far apart. But English with the German language, definitely, they go well together.
[i] How many years have you lived in Germany?
[r] I have lived in Germany for almost two and a half years. I’ve been here for two and a half years, but it’s okay. It’s going very well, thank God.
[i] Can you express yourself a little in German? so people can hear you? Can you speak anything in the language you are learning?
[r] Yes, no problem. I am [name], I come from that Congo. democratic, Congo, Democratic [Republic]. I am married. I am [have] two daughters. Me and [we live] together.
[i] It’s good, thank you very much. You said that you come from the Congo. You are married, you have two children here in Germany. Where is your wife? and the rest of the family?
[r] My wife is in Africa, she is in the Congo, in Kinshasa.
[i] Here you are with two children, like you said. Do you still have children in Kinshasa?
[r] Yes, I still have children in Kinshasa, I have one in Kinshasa [name], [name] and [name]. They stayed in Kinshasa.
[i] Overall, how many are you in the family?
[r] First from our parents we are eight, a big sister died, then the seven of us remained. I have five children, I have two here, three are in Africa. We pray to God, his power should express itself so that we can live together.
[i] I noticed that you accommodated your voice, when you talked about family. Do you think about her a lot? Can you express your feelings, such as the separation with the family, with the wife, with the extended family as well as with the immediate family of your own, [you, your wife and children], how do you feel about the distance that there is between you and them? How do you feel?
[r] So how can we say? In Africa you have the opportunity to visit friends and people. You have the opportunity to go to different places. But here it’s not like that, here everyone is often at home. So now, when you are with family, Wife and children, then it’s better. At the moment I’m with my two daughters, they are always together. I am with them only when there is a problem. If there is no problem, they are in their corner and I am in my corner. Me in my corner and they are in their corner. Such behavior often causes stress. That’s why, in these countries, for example in Europe is it better […] In the Congo it can’t matter at all, in Kinshasa you often meet your friends. But here it’s different. Here you are often alone. That causes a lot of stress. That’s why here, you see, It is better for a man to have a wife, just as it is better for a woman to have a husband. They are together, You don’t have to think much about it. You can also think of your father or your mother, or even your relatives, but when you are with your little family, in your household, then it’s different. Those who stayed, you know that God will help. You can also support them. When everyone is far away from you, there will be a lot of stress.
[i] This is an important point. […] What can you say to the authorities at them it takes a long time that someone fled his country, he came here, he left his family far away, they give many conditions, to give someone permission to travel. This leads to you being alone for a long time. What can you say to the authorities from Europe about such cases? [r?] When you see […] It’s about their consciousness, you know. Because it’s today, when we grew up, when our parents raised us, until we ultimately had to feed our parents. You feel that you have a good life, that you are with your family. But the reason that causes Africans to leave their country is the bad policies of the Europeans. If I will say what I can advise them, then it is really hard to comment on this. Because their consciousness works. It’s best we don’t talk about all of Africa, since I can’t look at the whole of Africa, but only via the Congo. A rich country in the world, there is everything in the Congo. People are already starting to produce electric cars. All this with natural products from the Congo. In the countries where the Congolese will go, if he has left his country because of war or hunger, or because of massacres, or something, that is where he should be received. Because we do not benefit from the wealth of our countries. I’m not talking about all of Africa because every African country has its own problem. I’m talking about our case. The population is poorly regarded, the population is hungry, they are sick, they are dying, there is no school, there is no work. Little girls of 10 or 15 years old engage in prostitution. The father may not [can? ] forbid them, the father does not work. The mother is not allowed to forbid them because she has no job. The woman tries to sell cassava flour on the corner, then the police arrest her. They throw their food on the ground even though the vendors pay their taxes. Every day you pay the tax that the city charges for the place of sale. But the police forbid her from selling in this place, they throw the sellers’ food on the ground. They all give a shit about their business. The food will be damaged, no one will be compensated for the goods, then the woman will stay at home and do nothing. She fed her children and her husband by selling cassava. It’s very difficult. For this case, especially for me, Congolese should be in all countries be well received. Because where we come from there are a lot of difficulties. We have many difficulties in our country. Every country in Africa has its own problem. I speak not for all countries in Africa, but for the Congo. Because I came from the Congo, especially the whole of Congo. So we were born in the Congo just to accompany the others, or we are born to benefit from the wealth of the land. Every Congolese thinks of this truth. That hurts. At the moment you see, in the event that someone has escaped, from his country and he applies for asylum in these countries, when he is received, in any case They should have a good heart, especially to us Congolese. I’m talking about the problems of the Congolese. No European forgets the problem of the Congo, everyone knows what is happening in the Congo. The population has a bad life, a seriously bad life. The food is hard to come by. If food is hard to get, how can the children go to school, it is not possible. Furthermore, if someone were to be a leader who sacrificed himself for the children, [then] it would often be the father. Dad isn’t there, the children are left alone, the children can’t go to school, where Dad is, that’s where he has to find himself, he still has to learn the language. The language is also not easy; it takes a long time to master it. You can’t start work today. The demands that our city authorities help us. If you received someone and gave them shelter, […] like me, it’s been two years now and I still haven’t received an answer. I still have preliminary documents, which causes difficulty. That’s why many in these countries sick, we often hear that someone in a city got psychological problems. He’s been taken to the hospital, he’s being treated. It’s because of the stress. With so much stress you go crazy. When you see that you have left the family, you left your wife and children, you don’t have a job here, you have not yet received an answer to your asylum application, that’s not a good life. This situation often happens with Africans, many Africans have these cases. The authorities of the countries where we came from should know about these cases. If someone has fled because of the problems they know, then they should satisfy him. They should also be able to follow the concerns of their family members who remained there. The city should take responsibility away from them, so that they can come here. If you say I’ll let her come here, even if I get a job, the number of children who stayed there and the woman […] Just the passport from the Congo costs 300 US dollars. How high is your salary so that you can apply for the passports? After the passports you have to apply for the visa if you don’t have a visa. The authorities have the right, if someone brings a case that they know, then they should advocate for the rest of the family, wife and children, so that they can succeed their father. The most expensive passport in the world is the Congo passport. This costs 300 [US dollars]. If you have 10 children and your wife, that’s eleven. Or did you leave 10 people, the wife and nine children. You have to spend three thousand dollars for just these passes. Three thousand dollars, when are you going to get that? If you bring the passport, the passport will be taken to give the visa. It is difficult to get a visa. So it is better that the authorities take care of the visa themselves. So that the person who received them and the family who stayed are able to live together. For this you should the authorities intervene.
[i] You gave me your daily routine, when you go to school, when you are free, […] or on a holiday, What are you doing, to somehow pass your time? Since you are alone here. But what do you do during the day? to spend on weekends or public holidays?
[r] So, in any case, when you have a place to go, If you have an appointment, it’s not easy to leave here. It’s not like in Kinshasa where you just go to a friend’s house. If I said to a friend that I would come to his house and he replied that he would not be at home, then you stay at home. Because of my behavior, I don’t go out often; I’m at home on the weekends. There are also places where you can go to listen to music and have a drink, but I don’t drink alcohol. I don’t go to bars either. Since I don’t go to bars, I feel like it’s a waste of time. You go to bars you drink alcohol and then that can lead you to other things, that’s why I avoid that. I often stay at home. Stuff like that are very heavy, it’s really hard. They are hospitable. But what’s missing what you could do is, if you have received someone for a specific case, let them answer him. When they have answered him, they can him give people the opportunity to get work. This will be the person who follows the courses clearly encourage for the future. There are people who stayed here for five or seven years without getting an answer. I know someone who is in this situation. To date he only has a preliminary document, it is difficult. So whoever is a foreigner in a country, to be sure that he can stay, he must have a document. If he doesn’t have a document, he has one foot in and one foot out. So a thing like this is very difficult. It’s hard because we have a lot of acquaintances, who find themselves in such situations. I’m not saying it will be like that for me. I know that God who brought me here he will make everything happen for me. But the problem is that you should know to handle this matter. How we live here there is respect among each other, there is no hunger either. You pay for my apartment, the electricity, the water. I get money for food every end of the month. It’s no problem there. The problem is that […] especially among the Congolese should they give a good answer, because where we came from hell reigns.
[i] You have [phone rings] insisted on the situation of the Congolese Authority should process the applications of Congolese positively. Now if we […] You talked a lot about politics from Congo Kinshasa. As we hear, is Congo Kinshasa a rich country, people say that God had left a lot of wealth there. But we always hear that many people from Congo Kinshasa have fled since the 1980s because of Mobutu’s dictatorship. Thereafter, for thirty years Mobutu remained in power. Many people also fled. If we look closely, many people had asylum applied for in Europe, because of the persecution of Mobutu’s dictatorship. You were born and raised there, please tell us about the Congo, about the politics of the old dictatorship and also from today’s politics, so that people can get an idea, why you are committed to taking in refugees from the Congo.
[r] What I can explain about it is the problem from the Congo [formerly: Zaire] It’s always difficult there. That’s why I said here, who they will vote for when the people elect their leader, then Europeans will not want him, they will place their leader. That’s why it doesn’t work in this country. Because it was in the era of Kasa Vubu [former President of the Congo, 1960-1965), although I was not yet born, but we heard that Kasa Vubu was said to have worked well. He would have been a good president. He would have worked very well he would have been a good president. But since his explanation, because he had liked his people […], because Lumumba [former Prime Minister of Congo, 1960-1961] would have defended his people, therefore they judged it poorly. So they decided to put their husband there. The Europeans want to use puppets. If they have used a puppet, then they will dictate to him. You may be used by Europeans to be their puppet, you need to know that the people are behind you. Without people, you cannot lead an empty country. Without a people you can only lead an empty country. You see, even during the Mobutu era, the situation in this country was still bad, it is very difficult. Mobutu was there, he had done whatever he wanted, he thought he was God, but he was only human. Where is Mobutu today? Even the country in which he ruled […] he was buried in Morocco. Laurent Desire Kabila [3. President, 1997-2001) came, since he was behind the people, they had seen that he would suffocate us, they had apparently liked him. I believe he stayed from 1997 to 2001. He is in power I think only stayed for three years. Until 2001, that is about three years. What he did in power he was murdered. A different president was then installed, we hear that he is his son. I don’t know if he’s his son or was a relative. His name is Joseph Kabila [in power 2001-2018]. As his son. The President Kabila, since he came to power, he became liked by the entire population from the Congo, because Mobutu didn’t have a good heart, he had not liked the population. But President Kabila, since he is young, we accepted him. But Kabila came; he had not paid the Congolese population well. What is the problem of the Congolese today: The Congolese need work medical treatment, schools, Class of Yabana In this country children can from the first Class until the end of school, even until university, learn without any contribution. The city can pay for everything, the country has enough natural wealth. Today people are insulting Kabila, Kabila did it like that and so on. But President Kabila Joseph, if he had had good advisors, he could not be where he is today. He couldn’t be where he is today. Why? You have the country, the country that has a lot of money. I don’t know what treaty they sign with the Europeans. Maybe the content requires mistreating the people so we can support you. I don’t know it. Because if it wasn’t like that, it wouldn’t be the way it is. With the age at which Kabila came to power, I don’t think he was, I think, 27 or 37 years old. How the people had adored him, the President Joseph Kabila, if he today the promise of the population he likes would realize […] First is the food, which is disrupting our country. The diet is not good, there are no hospitals, there are no schools. If he had improved on this point, no one could say anything against Kabila today. The population would have stood up for him so that he could get a new mandate. She could have said that he was better than Mobutu [2. President, 1965-1997]. But how can one explain that you are coming to power today? Today we know that the President Kabila Joseph many companies would set outside the country, but the Congolese are suffering, there is no work. That causes the difficulties. At the time when President Kabila had the power, he was still young. To this day he is still young. If I were to work with them today and you would lie to me, then I need to know that you are lying to me. If I filled my bag or not and theirs the bags of my relatives and the population must starve, but he will use this population against him. Today, President Kabila, if he worked with caution, if he tried to sort out his environment of bad people to employ good people, then we would say or do something against him today. Because Kabila, since he has assumed power in the Congo, its balance sheet is zero. He didn’t finish the five construction sites, hospitals, Promises of highways are not being realized, He didn’t realize free schools, […] there is no medical treatment, there is a bad diet, There is no work anymore. In the Congo, almost only 15% remained with the companies. […] 85% perished. There are no more companies. Today someone can want to sell clothes in the market, it can be used clothes, but you will be arrested by police and your goods will be confiscated. The country continues to decline. The relationship in the country is not good. Many people didn’t want anything more from Kabila, then he was put aside. They did a take [retake] with Felix. Then people say again that Felix didn’t win the election. Some don’t want him. Only Europeans know this thing. Because the Congolese people has seen a lot, suffered a lot. Now just watch it. The Europeans, since they founded Congo […] man tells that Congo was founded by Europeans. It’s like the Congo was an empty field and the Europeans had built houses and we Congolese, we went there to live. They take us like their slaves. It has to stay that way. The Europeans are lying to the African presidents. Here in Europe, you see today in France, François […] who else […] Macron fibbed when he travels to Africa, like he was in Nairobi, he laughed. But he has no peace in his own country. Why? In his country, the population has demands He has to fulfill this because it is the right of the people. But why doesn’t Macron kill this population? But they make weapons and give them to African presidents. They make weapons, they have factories to make weapons and they always sell that to the president so they can kill the people who elected him. There is no such thing. So that’s the difficulty. Today Felix is [current president] in power, but the people are not happy. Everyone says something bad about him. Some say he didn’t win the election and then with that former president acted. And he nominated him. He should be allowed to work instead of accusing him of various things. These things bother many Congolese. If really God could change the world if he changed the soil in the Congo, just like you dig the earth in the garden. One should dig up this earth and found a new Congo. Because we know it’s there […] […] which generation will be happy with this country? We were born in Mobutu’s time, […] children are still being born today. Since Kabila came to power, it’s been 18 years. If you say that the children born in Kabila’s time are French can speak or write then it is not true. Unless the father is rich. Never with children from poor families. They are thugs, they cannot read and write. They have nothing in their heads, they have no education because they didn’t go to school. Since Kabila took power [IN 2001 TO 2018,…] the children didn’t go to school, they had no education. The children grow up without prospects, the children have become thieves, some engage in prostitution. It’s very difficult.
[i] Thank you very much, you said when we talked that you are here with two children. What are your children doing? Which school do they attend?
[r] The children go to school, they are in the ninth grade. They go to school. They learn, they are hardworking. Since the city supports everything here, everything is financed by the city. The contributions and other things are covered by the city. You don’t have to look for anything yourself, be it money for pens or money for the contribution. That’s the problem in the Congo, in the Congo account you do that too. I heard that President Felix said that the children no longer have to pay school fees, that will be very good. If he does it like that, it will be very good, because the states in Europe do that. Here in Europe they have no natural wealth. But they made people’s lives simple so that that life could be stable. They have no natural wealth, they all come from Africa. Why don’t they go to Africa, where the natural wealth comes from, to use these things, free schools. Why not? This is bad.
[i] Do the children also have contact with German society? What do they do on weekends and in their free time?
[r] They have girlfriends, some friends come home, sometimes they go to their friends. They have their relationships with their white boyfriends and girlfriends.
[i] You worked [IN THE CONGO, …] in the field of auto mechanics. You said you go to school here. If you weren’t at school, you’ll be asked why. We hear that the Germans are very disciplined. What can you say between the discipline of the Germans and the people in Congo when you worked there? You worked in the Congo. […] And here you saw what the discipline is like you see in school.
[r] Well, in any case, the European is born with his discipline. In the Congo I don’t know anything about the discipline. In the Congo, it may be written on a wall that it’s forbidden to pee, but people will continue to pee in that spot. That mentality, I don’t know how to change the mentality of the Congolese. To understand life, can understand the world, you have to try to leave the country where you are suffering. So you can see the reality of some things. Because in the countries where we live now, it may be that you were rude or undisciplined there in the Congo, but when you come here, no one will advise you, you will get discipline yourself. It may be that you have a ballpoint pen, you notice that he doesn’t write anymore, you have to throw it away. In the Congo you can throw it away somewhere and move on. But here it is obligatory to throw it where the garbage is put. You can’t throw something away anywhere, even if you’re alone, no one is around you. This will be terrible for you to just throw this out like that. What discipline do you mean between Congo and here? There is discipline here, There is no need to correct you here, you will correct yourself. Here, whether it rains or snows, you have to go to school. If you didn’t leave, they’ll ask you why. If you have had an appointment, you must request a certificate and show it there. If you went to the hospital, you must get a certificate from there. […] If you have any problem, you must prove it with a certificate. They also call there to ask if you were there. They ask how long you were there, when you left. If school ends at 1 p.m. and you finished your appointment at 10 a.m., you are required to go to school. You should go to school and stay until 1 p.m. You can’t say it’s already 10 o’clock, then I’ll go back home. I didn’t see anything like that in the Congo. There, if you give something to the teacher as corruption, it will be left that way. Corruption is strong. But there is no corruption here. There is corruption here, as if a woman was caught in the act. There’s the problem.
[i] What help did you get here in Germany? be it by private individuals or at clubs or at the city?
[r] […] help, since I’ve been in Germany, I still get help from the city to this day. […] […] Since I came, everywhere I went I got help. The accommodation, the food and where I live now I have help from the city. I got a big apartment, a very large apartment. The state supports me with the apartment, he pays for the apartment, electricity and water. He gives us the money every month for food. Because he knows that he is at the moment […] he pays the fee for my school, four thousand euros per month. This is the help the school where I am, he pays four thousand euros a month, that is the help. For the acquaintances I met, what help I got from them: except here at the Bosangani club [in Bochum], the club where we are now. This is an African club. It is not just for Congolese but for Africans. When I come here I meet people from Guinea, from Nigeria, from Ghana, from the Congo, from […] they are Lebanese, I don’t know which country they come from. We all meet here. There are many of us. There will be around ten different nationalities in this club. The help I get here is when I have a problem, I come here, for example to President [name], he helps me, he explains to me some documents, some official steps. This is the help I got from friends. That’s what I get here at the Bosangani club, where we are now. All Africans, who will follow this video, should come here, there is help here. Help cannot come from money, we have come to a foreign country, we always need help as there are many problems for which you will need help. You can have letters that you can’t read, you can bring it here and find people who will read the letter for you. The people from the club can accompany you. They can accompany you to the place you don’t know. It’s better if you join here because you’re here in the club Bosangani is well helped. That’s why the government should […] especially the mayor of the city of Bochum, it definitely should help this association [Bosangani]. It can only be with paying the rent. […] Because they help many migrants. The German course is also offered here. It’s free. It’s really a help. If we Don’t come to the course here because we live far away, we attend the course near us where we live. […]
[i] You said that you and your children have an apartment, a large apartment for which the city pays the rent. When you first arrived, before you came to your current situation, where were you and how were you accommodated? Like what was it in the beginning?
[r] Even when we first came, the accommodation was also good. Where we first went the accommodation was good. We got an apartment. As I said, the European is organizing his thing in his own way, without asking anyone. It’s not like you got money to build housing for people to come. You see that the money is ten, you take five and you use five for work. Then the work will not be finished, as we experience in the Congo. That is the corruption. But here, right at the beginning, we came from the place where we were, we were sent to the border with Belgium, to Willich, we were always in hostels. We came here and we were always in hostels as well. But since they are following our problem, the apartment where we were accommodated was not enough. But this was a normal apartment. In the Congo this would be seen as a good, nice apartment. I could live there with my wife and children, but here, if the family consists of father, mother, son and daughter, there must be they get an apartment with three rooms. Because the boys should have their room, the girls should also have their room and the parents should have their room, that’s how it is here. That’s why we had to leave our last apartment and were given a larger apartment. Help with the apartment had been available since we arrived. We had not suffered in terms of housing or food. Everything is OK.
[i] Where you are now, do you have contact with the neighbors? A neighbor can do it be from the same apartment, or from the same district.
[r] Definitely, so I don’t know this is not Africa. There is no Africa here. It may be that your neighbor’s front doors are next to each other. As with us, our apartment is on the eighth floor, You can’t know the people on the first floor. You don’t even know your neighbors on the same floor. Everyone leaves in their time and everyone comes back in their time. You can rarely meet in the hallway and say hello or greet with “Good morning”, “Morning”. Then it’s over. When you see him where he enters, you will know where he lives. But to approach them And it’s hard to talk to them. In the case that he is an African, it is different. There may be some conversations there, but if he is not African, what should you say to him? This breed is very complicated. That’s the problem. But where I am, I’ve been there for a year now. I don’t know my neighbors. You don’t know me either. It really is. Except the well-known Congolese who live on the same street as me, we know each other well. Apart from them, I have no other contacts in my city.
[i] What do you do to practice your language, when you go to school. You learn the language there, when you return home, you don’t speak that language. You speak a different language with your children. How can you improve your language? What language do you use to speak to the children?
[r] We speak to the children in Lingala and French. Sometimes I try German with the children to see if they know the language. Sometimes I try to speak to the children what I learned at school. If the child responds, I know that the child will master the language over time. Sometimes I speak to my children in Lingala and they respond in German and then there is the case where I also answer in German. The children judge me and say that I also know the language. This is how it continues. But in order to master the language better, when I come back, or on Saturday and Sunday I’ll be in the room. There I turn on my computer, I follow programs in German, I often follow German theater, I listen to German music. I understand some words and some I don’t understand. What I don’t understand I will translate and then I will understand. I’ll translate this with my phone and I understand the meaning of the sentence. What helps with mastering the language is what I just explained. If you just stay at home like that, you won’t learn much. If you don’t have a computer, you can use the phone to translate words from German to French if necessary. You can write vocabulary on a paper so you can learn it. You can master German over time. This way you can quickly learn the German language.
[i] You said that you often speak to the children in Lingala and French. Do the children have contact with other people with whom they converse in German?
[r] He is a lot of contacts. There are many. The children talk to their friends regularly or girlfriends, they also come home sometimes. They also call each other. They often have telephone conversations and For a long time, the children only speak to their colleagues in German. During the conversation, the children often only speak in German from start to finish. Sometimes when we have an appointment at the town hall, we go together. And there You may have language impairment, but the child can speak from start to finish without any problems. All you have to do is explain to them what to say. Then she will have a long conversation with the officer without any problems. They quickly master the language because their minds are clearer. You have nothing to think about. But I have too many stresses because I have to think about a lot of things. That’s why I haven’t gotten any further with the language, but they already speak.
[i] Do you also help the family, wife and children who remained in Kinshasa, does she get your help too? […] This can be moral or financial support. How do they live there? We always hear that it’s in the Congo There would be unrest, there would be no work. Can you give us an idea when you were there, how did they live and now you’re missing there, what could they be missing?
[r] The problem of the Congo is very serious, the money we get for food is not enough, so that we can send it to them in order to survive. The money we are given is for our food. Because, to even […] you can buy, it’s just for food. It’s like this, we pay the money from the Internet at home, we have to eat, the African food that we often eat, that costs more than eating from here. Therefore, from the beginning to the end of the month the money is calculated. If you would still send the money there, that wouldn’t be enough. But the condition of life there is only intended to help God. The conditions there are very difficult. These are very difficult conditions. The money that is given here for food is just for that. The city also knows that the money is only enough for one month. If you deduct a little more, you may end up missing food for the month.
[i] When you lived there with them, how did you live together, how did you work, how did you care for them? […] Or was your wife working? Or was she a housewife and you worked alone? Can you explain what your family life was like?
[r] I worked, in Kinshasa it is rare for women to work. I’ve heard that for a long time, many companies have gone under, even men no longer have jobs, so where can women work? It’s a matter of luck. There are also women who work, you have to have relationships. If you have a friend who works at a company that is looking for someone, they can take you there so you can get hired. But at the moment, I just said, out of 100%, only 15% work in Congo. 85% are unemployed. When I was there, I had to fight my way through being a man. As a man, I somehow cheated my way through. I repaired cars, that’s how I earned something. Or I worked as a driver and we lived with that money. At the moment, they know what they are experiencing there because it is difficult because the difficulties are strong. There is suffering there.
[i] Now if we talk about Germany. Here are some communities, you will definitely live here with the Congolese and African communities. Do you have contacts, except with Congolese, with other Africans, How for example from Guinea, from Ethiopia?
[r] Since I got to know the Bosangani club, this is the first club I I encountered here in Germany, that is this one. Since I’m here I don’t need to look for another club, because this one is already ours. What they do for me is a big help. They don’t help me with money, but with a lot of things. This help is a lot for me. How can I leave here [the club] and go somewhere else? Because they don’t ask for money for help. No matter what your case is, they will try to help you. If you need a lawyer, they will get you one. They will accompany you and translate for you there, the lawyer speaks in German and they will speak in Lingala. There is help here. That’s why the people we met here, from Guinea and Nigeria, are always here to this day. Why should they go somewhere else? And I’m Congolese, why should I go somewhere else? I do not think so. We often hear that in Europe there is a lot of discussion between us, but here there is no controversy. Here we come to the meeting, if there is food then we eat and we drink something. We also hold parties here. If you have a contribution, you can give. If you can’t do that, give something next time. That’s why I’ve always said that the state […] Bochum should help this club so that it can move forward. Because he helps a lot of people.
[i] We hear that it is difficult to get a job in Germany. First of all, language is a big obstacle. In addition, the Germans are very bureaucratic, there are always a lot of papers, there is always a lot to sign. Have you encountered German bureaucracy yet? How did you find that? […] How are you received in the office? Good, bad?
[r] In any case, a lot of people arrived, it was difficult at the beginning. But today, if someone has come and he speaks the language of his country, which they don’t know, then they look for someone in their office who knows that man’s language. For example, they will ask: “Sorry, this man comes from the Congo, he speaks Lingala, who can speak Lingala here, so he can translate into German for us?” There aren’t any people missing. If someone speaks up, they will be called. There is always help. There is no neglect. […] If it really is there is no person to interpret, Translations are made using computers. You will write sentences in German and the computer will speak them in French, the same goes for the French answer, which is made in German by the computer. But there is no neglect in the offices. Your problem is that they let people work. Because I know there are a lot of people, who have already attended the course for a year or eight months, they have already done a lot of theory. So that they can practice the language, should they work, There at work they will apply the materials they have learned. If you tell me that, that’s what it means. You will quickly get used to the language. You can talk to your work colleagues there. Talking and doing things together will make language skills easier. You always have to go to school and you still don’t understand. To understand, it is better if you have already been to school for a year, then you should release him for work. He will learn a lot at work.
[i] What does “freeing someone to do work” mean to you?
[r] Yes, allow him to work. Permission to work. For example: someone has already attended school, someone has already attended school for a year, he can hear the language a bit, even speak, he must know that. But in order for him to get used to it, you have to give him a work permit.
[i] What is missing so that you can get a work permit? You can explain that if you apply for asylum here, when can you work? So that people can understand what difficulties lie there.
[r] What can I say? Because I, they have tested them, not yet for work. I asked whether I go to driving school can visit. Because here, no matter if you’re a pilot, They will not feel safe with you since you are a foreigner. You have to take the pilot’s course again. They have to teach you themselves and teach you well. You answered me that it for the work that I want to do, that I know before they will give me permission so that I can do a course, before that I have to do the language. Then you can give me permission. You can’t allow me to do that if I understand some things and don’t understand some things. Otherwise I will get into a lot of trouble at work. Because this job is not like a cleaning job, but you will get goods to deliver somewhere. You will be explained to which location you have to deliver the goods. In the warehouse you will be told where you have to put the goods with the forklift. These pallets must be brought to the truck. All of these You have to understand instructions, if not, it’s difficult. In my case it’s normal, I noticed myself that I still need to improve the language. If I improve the language, this work will be beneficial for me in this country. But for other people it is unfortunate and very difficult. We Africans come to these countries to search. What we want to do first is to master the language. If you already know something about them, even just a little, then that’s it It’s better if you get permission to work. You will continue to learn at work, we Africans learn faster. But if you leave the person like that without being able to do anything, it is as if they have handcuffed the person. Just leaving a person in one place for two or three years, he just needs to learn the language, has left the family. He left his wife and children. Or a woman who has left her husband and children. Now he doesn’t work, the money you get for food is limited. This means you can’t help the relatives who stayed there. So you should free people to do the work. You see the politics of France, they have different politics. Your politics is a model. If someone comes, he can work with the help of his relatives, but here, there is no such thing. That’s the problem.
[i] Up to how many years can an asylum seeker work? What is the condition, do you have any idea?
[r] As far as I know it depends on the cities. Because I know a lot of people many friends, who we used to hang out with, then we were assigned to different places. All we hear is that in the city we were sent to, if we had come to change the address, the old address should be changed to the new one, We would have been given permission to work immediately. Well, I know a lot of people. That depends on the cities. For example in our city I see a lot of boys there are many boys, they just go to school. When you finish one school, you start the next. But that’s not the case in other cities. Even with women I know who we were in the same position with. Many people say that I only went to change the address, then I would have been given a work permit. Every city has its own style. You see, we can’t talk about the years. That depends on the cities. They say that before you work in that one company, you have to know the language. I know a lot of people I know about four people who even came after me. They just say, “Good morning.” Sometimes when you him Greeted with “Good morning,” then he starts laughing. He laughs because he doesn’t know how to answer. But he works. Some work does not require knowledge of the language. If you have to care, you don’t need the language. That depends on the cities. Some cities are closed.
[i] Have you already asked for a work permit? What answer did you receive?
[r] During this time I had attended school. I tried to get permission to work. The colleague who lives near me tried to help and talked to his boss about me. I was supposed to be hired at their company so I could work in the workshop. He took me to the company and was told there was no problem. I should come back with my documents. I also brought my documents with me afterwards. They had seen the documents and noticed that I didn’t have a work permit. I then went to the job center and asked for the work permit. There I was told that I have to go to the company, the company should give me the salary that I will get, they should say exactly what work I will do, they should also say the time of my work. The company said if they fill out the form it takes a long time to get a response from the job center receive. You need an employee in two weeks. When you fill out the paperwork and send it to the job center, It will take a month or even a month and a half and the position will then be filled. That’s why they didn’t want to sign the form. The company further says that the job center has the work permit should give. The salary and the work to be done. If they would give permission, We would hire you and you could bring the documents you need to the job center. So that was it a misunderstanding between the company and the job center. But I think the company is right. If someone asks for permission, the person comes to the company and the company signs all the documents, There are also the work and the working hours and the reward given. The documents are submitted to the job center. But it won’t decide in a week or two, but it remains with the documents for over a month, or a month and a half. But during this waiting period the company wants you to work for them. During this waiting period, the company needs someone to fill the position, then the company will hire someone else. That’s why the company refused to sign the documents. She said that the wages I would receive, the work I would do there, and the hours worked would be on the paperwork. Because it’s common practice when you get hired, you have to bring the documents to the job center. The company said the job center must give permission and Jobcenter said that the company has to sign first. They did that to me twice, then I didn’t want to do it anymore. I didn’t feel like it anymore, that’s a complication. If the company would sign, she gives the wages, and the time, and then the documents are handed in to the job center, The job center should decide directly. If the job center keeps the documents for a long time even though the company needs the person for the job. The job center should allow the person within a maximum of two weeks to so that he can work. If you wait a month or two months, the company will have to hire someone else. That causes problems with the companies. Some don’t want to anymore sign the documents. The company says even though you only know a little German, there are people here who speak French, you can work with them. Over time, with their help, you will get used to the language. The company was open with me. The people at the job center were complicated, otherwise I could have worked in the workshop today.
[i] What is your wish for the German authorities? […] So that these problems no longer occur with migrants or political asylum seekers in the future? When someone gets a job, they have to get the paperwork signed. What advice can you give or what suggestion do you have?
[r] There are Things we encountered here that already exist. That’s their country’s rule, but they should try to control these things, to follow them. Since I had already asked for the work permit twice, because I found two places. Because they said the company had to do it and the company that the job center has to do that. The matter ended so simply without any result. I have no one to complain to or give an explanation. If they had follow-up on these things, they could know how things are going. When they receive migrants in the country, and they work, the country’s economy will continue to develop. Between the contribution of four thousand euros per month, what they pay, they want the person to go to school for six more months and the person the company already wants to hire, The company confirmed that I could work for them despite my lack of the language. They had made paper so I could go to the job center. The job center should sign, the job center should give permission. The job center caused complications. Between the contribution they pay and the person who can work in the country who will pay the tax so that the country’s economy can grow. You want to continue paying the contribution without letting the person work. The country’s economy develops when people work and pay taxes. Few migrants work in our city of Velbert. All people complain. Everyone complains. They should be allowed to do so. When a migrant comes to the country, he wants to work. It is not the case that the migrant wants to work for the stay. The migrant has to work. Wherever we come from, we have left people there. We left children, family and parents. We have to work with what little we get. We will pay the tax, some will live with it and still others will support the relatives who stayed. It is like that.
[i] Thank you very much for your suggestion. What does Congo mean in your life?
[r] What does Congo mean in your life? Congo is my country, I was born there.
[i] If you compare the Congo and the country where you are, Germany, how do you feel here? What’s the difference, your life here and in the Congo? Are you homesick, what feeling do you have in your city? Since you are far away from the Congo?
[r] I no longer have that feeling for this country. If I had stayed in this country, I would already be under the ground and would have died. I no longer have the feeling of this country. I have feelings for the country where I am. How I am accommodated. How they received me, how I was accommodated. I have a lot of feeling. But to have a feeling, I have to have my wife and children with me. I’ll have a good feeling about that. But I have already forgotten the feeling of the country where I came from. Because this is not a country, but the path to death. This is not a country, this is not a state, but the path to death. If you do something, you will be killed, arrested or tortured. We have nothing to say there, there are no human rights. My feeling says to stay here in this country. Nevertheless, as soon as my wife and children come, I will have a good feeling when I work, I earn money, I pay the taxes of this country. I do everything I’m supposed to do and I support the relatives who stayed there.
[i] Now you’re still busy with the language, what do you actually want to do in Germany? if you get lucky, that the state gives you normal residence, what do you really want to do?
[r] What should I do since I am a craftsman. I am a craftsman, I will do my work. It may be that I am not a craftsman. Every person who comes from the Congo, left the relatives there with difficulty. When he goes to a country, what future will you have? Only work is your future. So that you get something so that you can help yourself. And so that you can help those who stayed. Because I don’t know those who come to Europe and they only think about eating and drinking. They forget where they came from, the origin. This is not good. It’s very bad. If you watch the Congo closely, the majority, especially in Kinshasa, because I don’t know the whole Congo, in Kinshasa the majority, 100%, prevails poverty is 90%. Poverty is 90%. That’s the problem. Because every person who leaves the country is Joseph in his family, to help his family. My future is work. Even if I wasn’t a craftsman, I could have done any work to earn something for myself. And so that I can help other people, parents, relatives and family. It really is.
[i] You said that you are a craftsman, can you explain your profession, what you learned, what you had learned, shall we say?
[r] The majority of Congolese, just because our leaders are bad, it is a country if the leaders would help the people the Congolese people are very intelligent. There are also stupid people but there are also smart people. Like me, if I know a bit of wall work today, then because my father was a bricklayer. On Saturday and Sunday I accompanied him to work, I had his Tool bag carried, in which was a folding rule and the trowels. I was able to learn how to work on walls. I know this a little. I also know painting work. But my trained profession is a driver and car mechanic. I count that more. I worked as a driver for a long time. I worked as a driver for a long time. In the same way, I worked as a mechanic for a long time, because I had worked at […]. I had learned mechanics from […] at Skoda in Limete [Kinshasa municipality]. So that’s where I learned to be a mechanic. We made our industrial mechanic. We also did car mechanics. So I really have experience in this work. I really expect it. It was through this work that I had the children and I raised the children with it.
[i] Do you also have the opportunity to work in this area, [car] mechanics?
[r] Yes, I am capable of doing that. […] I was told by the authorities that… it would be easy for me with my work, to do an apprenticeship. Because here, if they give you a truck to drive, can you drive, but the people here don’t trust you, they have to send you back to school. They will teach you themselves, then they will be satisfied. Then they can trust you. What they told me was that I should learn the language well, but the Training costs are expensive, that is 15 thousand euros. Where I am at school now, The school fee costs four thousand euros. But they told me to learn the language, until they see that their plan is fulfilled. Then you know […] You will pay fifteen thousand euros for me to practice from the truck [truck] can do. I will drive a big car and buses. You already promised me that. I am sure that the Europeans are not lying.
[i] We know that Germany is a car country. A country where a lot of cars are produced. People are wanted in this area. Do you already have an idea? where you will work, are there prospects in this area? How do you like that?
[r] There is nothing to look for here, no work to be found here. There is work here. There really is work here. There is work here, it just depends on you where you will apply. Where it will work, that is where you will work. If I want to work in a company today, if my thing will be okay, I will work in a company where I want. It is: “Man thinks, God directs”. You can say I just want to work here, but it depends on God. God fulfills the projects of men, but whatever God has chosen for you, that is where you will be sent. It is like that. There are many who said they would go to France, but they stayed here. There are also some who wanted to come to Germany and ended up in France. Some wanted to go to Belgium and are in Sweden. You go where God has prepared.
[i] What can you say about the authorities, for example from the Congo, [a telephone rings] because many people have learned. You finished school in Congo. But they didn’t get any work there. But here in Europe, where these people have not learned, they will in theirs profession that they did in their countries. What message can you send? give our authorities, because of the people who went to school there, who graduated from school there but can’t get a job?
[r] Only the will applies to every thing. Only the will applies to every thing. Congo today contains many intelligent people. There are many who have finished university, some have done their doctoral thesis, many have completed the training. They have done a lot and everything possible, but there is no work. Everything depends on the authorities of the country. You have to help the people. The Congolese people, if President Joseph Kabila has stopped and reinstated Felix today, then they should let Felix go so that he can work in peace. Because he knows the difficulties because he has lived in Europe for a long time. He knows the difficulties of Europe. He knows the condition of Europe and also social life. He is the one who will know how to support the Congolese people. He knows life in Europe. And he knows social life in Europe, the medical treatment, the education […] Let’s give him the chance so he can work. Let’s see […] But with this chance he should have advisors, Having lived in Europe, he knows what social life is like. He knows everything. So he won’t disappoint the Congolese. So it is like that. Because it is very difficult.
[i] You have lived in Germany for some time, there is some change in the lives of migrants in Germany today, Maybe you have heard how the lives of migrants used to be was in Germany and what changes were made. Today there are also some changes, but, but there are still some things that have yet to be changed. Things that we migrants would like to see changed. What change can you suggest to the German authorities and for the future of political asylum seekers or migrants?
[r] The problem is, that the migrants who come to this country and those in all the countries they go to, that they should be well received. In addition, migrants should I don’t know as since I Since I was born in the Congo, I didn’t expect to one day leave my country. I didn’t expect that, the world was still that way back then a little better. I managed back then. Even though I didn’t earn much. But I had had something to eat. I was also able to send the children to school. I didn’t expect to leave the country. But if I leave the country today, it is because of the living conditions. You’re not allowed to testify there, if you do you’ll be arrested or killed or something. If you do something, you will be imprisoned without a trial. And in such a case you have no one who can help you. Some die. So if you have the opportunity to leave the country […] How we left the country, i.e. […] especially we Congolese, everywhere we go, definitely, everywhere we go, we should be welcomed by the host country. Because the conditions that exist there were created by Europeans. The Europeans are bringing disorder into our countries. You don’t have to complain about the many migrants who are coming now. Lately I’ve noticed on the trains and buses that the diasporas are trying to explain why people come here. They are destroying Africa, but they are good in their countries. What can I say to the authorities here? The authorities should take good care of refugees and migrants. Because a woman does not leave the marriage without a reason, if the woman in the marriage is well fed, well dressed, the husband meets her needs, the woman will not leave the marriage. If you see the woman leaving the marriage, you have to ask that woman. Even if today she refuses to say the reason, but tomorrow she will, she will be proven right. It is like that. It’s not because the man hit the woman. The man beats her more often, to the point where he wanted to kill her. That’s why the woman fled. That’s why we flee. So wherever we go, we should be welcomed by the people who receive us. They should help us, especially the Congolese people. I speak for us Congolese. We are scattered in the world, because of the condition of the country. But if you all the countries of Africa, even the world, considered, then there is no country that has more natural wealth than the Congo. That doesn’t exist, the Congo is number one. But why then are the Congolese people scattered?
[i] In order for us to cope with these difficulties, in our countries, for example in the Congo, what can the Europeans do so that these difficulties can be ended?
[r] They have human rights in their country. Europeans have human rights in their countries. Why doesn’t human rights work in Africa? Here in Europe, when the president’s mandate ends, he will leave power without discussion. Why isn’t it like that in the Congo? Only they, when the people elect a leader, they don’t want him, they put their own leader. He takes an oath. He takes an oath. At the end of the mandate he doesn’t want to go. Even Europeans will give him weapons, which they create to kill the people. That’s the problem. They have to know what they’re doing. The African is a human being. The African is not an animal. The difference between wise men and black people is only the color of their skin, but the blood is the same. Every person is a human being. You don’t have to think that the wise ones are special. Or that they are Jesus Christ, they are not Jesus Christ. We are all human. So you […] I don’t know if it hurts them when you hear that there have been repeated massacres in the Congo, or not. Maybe this is a pact that they, the Europeans and African leaders with whom Demon have concluded, I don’t know. Otherwise you have to be sad. With them here, if only a human only one policeman would have died in an ambush, then there would be national mourning. But the many people dying in Congo, when will there be national [mourning]? People die every day, day after day, morning, noon and night. They can’t find a solution because they force it on the presidents in these countries. They have to know what they’re doing. The world is turning. This may be that tomorrow God will found a new world in which the wise will become black and black people will become wise. Then the blacks will rule.
[i] We hear that people are being killed in Congo, some escape, some cannot escape. Those who can escape, what difficulties will they encounter on the way? We sometimes see people coming from countries in Africa, some have to cross the sea, some have to flood. If you have to explain […] to the people who will follow you, what suffering do the people who flee to come to Europe have? A lot of people only follow this on TV, but since you also fled, what difficulty do these people face before coming to Europe?
[r] The first problem is the people who get into dugout canoes [pirogue, wooden boat]. They climb into dugout canoes so they can reach Morocco or Spain. And then they try to cross the sea and then get on to Europe. But when they receive them, question them. After your questions you will get answers, then through these answers you will have to find solutions. You have to analyze why they fled, what explanations they give; then find a solution. They must question their leader. Why is the population fleeing? If they don’t question the leaders, then they are an accomplice. They are accomplices. It’s unfortunate, it’s very difficult. The conditions of the migrants’ journeys […] many will die, some will reach Europe. Unfortunately, they are arrested and sent back. However, they fled the risk. Because they crossed the sea, they risked their lives. A European cannot take such a risk. They reach Morocco and Spain with the dugout canoes so that everyone has the opportunity to go to another country wherever they want. When they come here, they will be interrogated, they will answer all the questions. What solution will the Europeans find? They are the ones who appoint the presidents in their countries. There is no solution, so they have to suffer. Africans do not flee for fun, when he [the African] comes here he must be treated well. If he is not well received as they are leaders in their countries to use force, they must alert their presidents. You have to do what the people want. How can the president fulfill the will of the people? Since they gave him conditions, He cannot fulfill this will because they have forced many things on him. He cannot arrange the people’s problem. What they told him he choked on it. Even if he wants to do something good for the population he is not able because they have given him condition. So they know that. So all migrants in this country should be welcomed.
[i] I’m still asking in this area, the risk that Africans accept, so that they can come to Europe, take that because of dictatorship in your countries. Don’t you see that man? accepts crossing the sea, that means the situation is worse, in the countries they leave. Some even say that it would be better for me to sink into the water than to stay in my country. That’s why we should make Europeans aware of human rights in Africa. You talked a bit about human rights earlier, can you talk about human rights in Africa or in the Congo, how they are not respected in Africa and in the Congo. If people have to flee and if they are even ready to sink into the sea, what can you say?
[r] There are no human rights. There are no human rights in Africa, they don’t exist. Last time I saw on the internet, I think it was on Friday or Thursday. In Mbinza [district of Kinshasa] stood a driver from a taxi bus with his customers in a traffic jam. Then the general came. […] The general wanted to convert the jeep into an airplane. Since it is not possible to convert the Jeep into an airplane, The general wanted the bus driver to clear the way so that the general could continue his journey. Since there was no place for the driver to go could, to clear the way for the general, The general’s bodyguard got out and shot the driver. The driver was inside his car with the customers. The driver died on the spot. What kind of country is this? That can only be the Congo. Why? Because he’s a general! Alleged general, can the country be run like this? The country cannot run well like this. Felix came with the rule of law, so we shouldn’t hinder him. He should bring this constitutional state to the end. Anyone who did something must be arrested. We don’t know whether he will achieve that. All we hear is that he supposedly signed contracts with his husband [Kabila]. You know yourself. This country is destroyed, there is not a single human right. Arrests and killings are commonplace. A country cannot reach this level.
[i] Mr. [Name], as you you were in the Congo, Did you also experience scenes in which human rights were violated? Have you also been a victim of worse experiences? Maybe you can tell me about it what was done to you, something that affected you where human rights were violated?
[r] The Congolese people are always victims. The Congolese people are always victims of everyone. I gave the example of driver when working with customers was killed in the car just because of a traffic jam. He didn’t cause the traffic jam either. The general was supposed to move on, but there was no way the driver should carry his car and put it to the side so that the general could continue his journey. Since he was unable to put the car on the side, he was shot in the car. The Congolese people are victims of many things. All Congolese are just victims. You have no right to speak, you will be arrested for just saying a little. So human rights in the Congo are not respected. All the people in Congo, even in Kinshasa, are victims of this. When I say all people, that means I’m a victim of these things too. All people are victims, you are not allowed to express your opinion. You have to agree to everything that is said. If you say anything against it, you will either be killed or arrested or even beaten.
[i] What message can you give to Congo’s politicians? so that change can one day come to Congo. What message can you give them to… to bring about change in the Congo and in the future?
[r] I can’t find a politician in the Congo There are no politicians in the Congo. It is better for everyone who has completed their school or university, those who have already completed it and those who are completing it now, you should give them the opportunity to enter politics and work there. They should form a new political class. It will be better. For me in Congo, there are no politicians. There is no politician. The politicians speak in the name of the people and the same politicians will stand against the same people. If you look closely, you won’t find any politicians. There are many of them who, for me, are not politicians. Many have often insulted Kabila, but today they are behind him and they are against the people. So there are no politicians. I have no advice to give. Only those who have graduated from universities have completed law, all these people, should be given the opportunity to form a new political class. It will be better, I don’t see any politicians among the old people that I can say anything good about.
[i] And for the Europeans, We migrants, we want changes in our lives here. There should also be a change in our countries because people don’t walk without a reason, if someone moves around it means that they are looking for something. It may be that he is threatened where he is, that he doesn’t like it. He wants to go somewhere else. He has to escape. What message can you give to Europeans about the general change in the lives of migrants here in Europe?
[r] I had already spoken about this matter. I have said, especially the migrants from the Congo, when they appear somewhere, then you have to receive them well. Because no country in all of Europe forgets what is happening in the Congo. You know that. They also know what is being done in the background. So migrants from Congo must be welcome everywhere. He must be well received. I don’t know all of Africa, I’m only talking about the Congo. Because the problems are different. But we are a rich country. The people have not seen the wealth, the people don’t know that. People talk about cobalt, uranium, copper and so on. But the people from the Congo do not know this natural wealth, yet they die because of it. It doesn’t know this, nor does it ask for money from it. But it dies because of it. What witchcraft. Is this the complicity of Europeans? But Europeans know these things, so what should we say What advice should I give, you already know what it’s about. You follow what is happening in the Congo morning, noon and evening. The country does not have human rights, you are not allowed to speak, you are not allowed to do this or that. They kill people with bats, with starvation, in cells, with poison and so on. For the people of Congo, I don’t know what the world […] If an African says something against his president, I can tell him that it is worse in the Congo. In our country it is exaggerated. There are more difficulties there than in other countries because I have seen many countries. It is a heartbroken country.
[i] To close, with your life in Velbert and also in the area around Velbert, in the cities of Bochum and Essen. How you are received here, are you satisfied with the German authorities about their reception?
[r] I’m happy, I’m doing very well, I’m doing very well. Just one concern I can have is the work permit. People should be given permission to work. Although every country has its politics. But in France people start working after just a month’s stay. But today, one Receiving migrants in the country is already a big contribution. Because when he works, he further raises the country’s economy. All I can say is that the work permit should be given. In other cities, people are being detained because they don’t want to give work permits. You should give the work permit. If this city 200 migrants, if the 200 or 150 migrants work, then the city will get a good jump. Migrants are people who work. Migrants don’t stay at home, they work. He likes the work. Now is the time for people to work. If you have to stay without work for a long time and after 10, 20 years you get a permit, so that you can work for how long? Now is the time. You should give permission. Migrants work, migrants […] Africans know many professions. […] Whatever you give him, he will do. You just have to give permission. There are cities when you come, you just want to change your ID, change the address, then you will immediately get the residence permit. There are some cities where you just have to stay there, you just have to go to school there. They should let us work.
[i] Can you imagine, you and your whole family, living together in this region? When will you get the residence permit? I asked because some people change cities once they get their residence permit. If you get the papers today, can you and your family imagine just staying where you live [now]? And that the children go to school there? And you continue your work?
[r] Yes, where I am, it really is […] it is a city that I like very much. It’s a quiet town. It is a city where there is no disorder. It is also a suitable city to educate children. Verlbert is a very good city. She is also good for raising children. The city is quiet, there is no disorder, I like this city. I expect to stay there. I have no intention of moving out of there, I like this city, it’s quiet. It’s not like other cities where you find violence. There is peace there. This peace and quiet is good for us who don’t go to bars, who don’t drink alcohol. That’s good for me. It could be bad for a person who often goes to the bars. There he will feel like he is in prison. But for me it’s a good city.
[i] Thank you for your availability to participate in our project, especially taking part in the interview. We wish you much success in Velbert and the surrounding region for all your projects. Your wishes should be fulfilled, and also that your family will come to you one day.
[r] Thank you President [name].