SU_B_21

[i]Good morning, [name]. Good morning Thank you for coming today to take part in this interview organized by Museum Bochum. We are very pleased that you are here today. To present your work to the people of the country. This is the first time we’re doing this. My name is [name] We are now in Bochum. […] […] […]
Thank you very much. This was just a test.
Hello Madam. ..
[r] [name]
[i] My name is [name] I have an interview [today with mom name] because of our program at the Bochum Museum. She introduced herself today to do an interview with us. We thank her very much for that. We are here in the center of the Bosangani e.V. association. An African club from Bochum. And here we will conduct the interview. Hello Ms. [name], thank you very much for coming to take part in the interview. We don’t have much to say at first, we ask you to introduce yourself first so that the people you will follow should know who you are and who they follow.
[r] Thank you, my name is [name]. Thank you for the opportunity to do an interview with you in such a short time. I’m ready. I am Congolese from the DRC
[i] Thank you very much. We are in the city of Bochum, you are also in the city of Bochum, Can we ask you, how did you end up in the city of Bochum? We already know that you are African, exactly Congolese, but now you are in Bochum. How did it come about that you find yourself in Bochum?
[r] Eh, I came to the city of Bochum because I like the city. When I came to Germany, I lived in Stuttgart. I thank you, the Germans, because you welcomed me into this country. They’re even nice. It’s not good to see everything positively. They had welcomed us, given us shelter and food. But a small difficulty What we had, we were not allowed to go to other cities. We were like in prison. That was a bit difficult. Where we weren’t allowed to go was where Oil was sold, that fits ours. But we were forbidden to go there. Another difficulty was that we weren’t allowed to work. That was one of the difficulties. Money we were given to live on wasn’t enough. We really had difficulty. There was also a greater difficulty We remained undocumented for many years. So we were really like people in prison. But thank you very much for welcoming us to your country. We are very grateful for this. I, for example, pray for you that you should be well, that your health should be good, that the country’s economy should also run well because you welcomed us. Really you are nice. I found you nice to us. But there was a time this law was abolished. They gave us work, we worked. With work, the accommodation they gave us at the beginning wasn’t that good [she laughs]. I apologize here, sorry, These houses weren’t good, but once we got jobs we were able to look for better housing. We lived in a good apartment. We decorated the apartment ourselves. We earned the money ourselves. We had paid the rent ourselves and we had exempted ourselves from social security. We had led a better life. After that we got papers. I had a child here and my child was successful at school. The child went to private school. The child grew up here. May God bless you. Above all, thank you very much. The country should develop well. When we came, we saw. You shouldn’t think that we only experienced bad things. There were good things too. They’re good, they’re nice. I really like Germany, I have experienced a lot of good things here. Germany should develop well, the economy should always improve. But when I lived in Stuttgart, I didn’t always want to stay in one place. I wanted to go somewhere else. Then I changed my place of residence and came to Bochum. When I came to Bochum, I was very happy about the city of Bochum. I find you very relaxed here. [she laughs] They’re beautiful. I didn’t stay in Bochum long, luckily I found a job. Even where I work, people are very nice to me. We get along well, we’re like family, like we’re related. If one day I have to leave this country, I will definitely not forget you. Everywhere I will go, I will speak well of you. They’re really on my mind. I am currently in Germany. My child also grew up doing design as an education. I have a child, his father is no longer alive, my child also had a child, my grandchild. We live well. I did the language, I also speak a little. My advantage in life I didn’t know the language. But since I live here, she could understand. I also learned a bit. I can also write a little. At work I talk to my colleagues and we get along a bit. But every country has its own laws. The laws you had given us had to be obeyed like them. We had to do that because that’s how it is in life. Every country has its laws. But when you refused us the papers, I had difficulty because I have family in France, I couldn’t visit my relatives. I got the papers after the new year. After new years, that was very difficult. I ask you, in the love of Jesus Christ, I know that the German people are Christian. The people who come after us should not have the same difficulties as we had. Because in a person’s life, add ten years, it’s a lot. I got papers after nine years. I had no more hope, but in the end You had taken pity on me and you had given me papers. Now I’m going to France to visit family. It is very nice. May God bless you and the country will continue to develop. I like you, the German. I liked the city of Bochum, they are relaxed. Here in Bochum, I like the city, it is very beautiful.
[i] Thank you very much. You came to Bochum, you said that you had lived in other places, including Stuttgart. Let’s say you’re coming from Congo to Germany, which cities have you been to? Sure, you were in Stuttgart and then you came to Bochum. This can give people idea about the places where you have been.
[r] When I came to Stuttgart, in Stuttgart we were […] We were in Spain. We came to Stuttgart, we came to a town called Göppingen. We arrived in Göppingen. We were the first asylum seekers in Göppingen. We were welcomed in a former American fighter. When we were there, That was the time when people were sent to the GDR. That was a very difficult moment. People went to GDR. But we were lucky, we were lucky, I was married too. When we were in Göppingen, there was some work there. Because it was an American fighter there, we helped with the work. When we helped with the work, other people didn’t help. We continued to help. Almost all the people who were there were assigned to the GDR, except for me and my husband. We were then assigned to Waiblingen. Only we had gone there. We stayed there. After seven years, my husband got cancer. Then he died. When he died the child was four years old. That wasn’t easy. My husband dies in 1999. The child was already five years old. When my husband was sick the child was four years old and then when the child turned five my husband died. That was very difficult. God helped, I got a job at Bürger King in Waiblingen. Citizen King’s boss was Mr. [name]. I can’t forget his name, he hired me. With this work I was given a visa for two years. When I got a two-year visa, I left Citizen King, then I got a job at the Hotel Millennium. When I worked in Millennium, I received a permanent residence permit. I lived in Stuttgart for a long time. Then I decided to come near other countries. Since I have family in France and Belgium, I didn’t want to travel long distances anymore. After two hours I’m already in Belgium, after half an hour I’m in Holland, and I’m in France for four and a half hours. What made me so you came up. Near the countries where I have relatives. That’s why one day I decided to come here. Stuttgart is south. That’s where Baden-Württemberg is. Now I have come to NRW. When I came here I was very happy, much more than in Stuttgart. But in Stuttgart I was welcomed there and I didn’t forget that. I can’t forget you either, you’re all related. You are my relative, I love you very much.
[i] Thank you very much. You spoke about Bochum on the side, what is your impression of the city of Bochum, whether it is positive or negative? What can you say?
[r] How I got to Bochum.
[i] Your impression positive or negative?
[r] My impression in Bochum, I haven’t seen anything negative yet, because when I came I already had a residence permit. When I came, I already had my papers. Another thing that struck me is that there are many festivals in the city in summer. We are taken into account. Plus, I got the job from there. When we were in Feste, I noticed that we were taken into account. I saw a German woman who came to me. I had pleased her. She asked me: What is your name? I gave her my name. I said my name is [name]. And my first name is [name]. She asked me if I wanted to work. I answered yes. Then this woman hired me. So I came here, and found lightness. I found work from the street. I found a lot of ease here. Be really relaxed here, like where I came from. I was very happy for Bochum. I didn’t encounter any difficulty because I found a nice apartment here, I live in the city center, in Victoria Street, I’m in Bermuda. I’m good, I haven’t had any trouble here yet. I find the people here very nice.
[i] You just spoke about your district, can you describe your district? My district There is opposite my apartment a house where music is often played, opposite my apartment. Music is often played there.
[i] It is a music forum.
[r] Yes, this is the music forum, There is music playing there, I’m curious sometimes and I watch people play classical music. There is a discotheque opposite me. If I walk a bit is there a place where people spend their time, they drink juice, Beer, … I’m actually very happy. I really live in the center, in the middle. Opposite me is the music forum. I walk to the store, REWE is nearby, TK Maxx is also nearby, EDEKA, Lidl also opposite me. Everything on foot, main station opposite me. In any case, I’m good. Everything is done on foot. TK Maxx is there, shops everything….is there. By the time I arrived, I hadn’t taken the bus yet. I do everything on foot. I only take the subway if I want to go to work. In any case, I’m good. Here in Bochum really everything is positive.
[i] Except your city center district, can you visit another part of Bochum? [deer, I know where I work, eh… my district, I take the subway… 308 in the direction of the protective bank. I get off in Nordbad. I know that.
[i] Thank you very much. Let’s talk a little about leisure time in the community of Bochum, Here where do the people go, we would like to know if you have free times, where do you spend your time, what entertainment do you use here in Bochum. And what contacts do you have? with the German communities Let’s talk about free time first.
[r] I often meet my friends in Bosangani. Above all when I meet my acquaintances from Bosangani meet, … We like each other. We like each other very much, there is understanding between us. We live well together. Every time we are there, we share news, we also talk about our homeland, We’re also talking about here, we now have two countries. Here where we are welcomed, and the countries we had left. We talk about the countries we have left and where we will be welcomed. We come to the Bosangani club. I often go for a walk in… When I get out there, there is a place where you can have a conversation. I sit there sometimes, I drink juice there, I visit shops, that’s how I do it.
[i] What is Bosangani please? Because all people don’t know what Bosangani is. Can you describe Bosangani?
[r] Bosangani is a place, is an association, we meet there, there we bring ourselves trouble. If you have a problem because you don’t have a lawyer, they will put you in touch with the lawyer. You can follow your cause. Follow-up can change the negative decision to positive. We also have our boss, [name], he is here. [name] helps us. You can have a letter, it can be from the employment office or the job center, it may be that you don’t understand some of the words, [name] can read it for you. Then you understand the content better, and when it comes to something, that is being pursued further, he will do that too. If you have a difficulty, he can also accompany you. So we’re good with him. We get along well with our bosses who are here. They are nice to us. They are nice to us. They pity us when difficulty arises. Wherever they manage to do something, they do it. If they can’t do anything, they know what to do. We are good with them. Sometimes they call us, we are in regular contact. As I come back from work, I come here more often to find out what’s new. What is to be reported? We are together and we get along well.
[i] Thank you very much. Do you have contacts with the African community as well as Congolese, apart from the meetings in the Bosangani center?
[r] Since I’m new here, I haven’t met many of my country’s people. I’m still a stranger in Bochum. But acquaintances that I have met are those that I have contacts with. We often go to Bosangani together. I have contacts with them and I also have contacts with Guineans, with Ivorians, Cameroonians, with many friends who are here. We meet here, it’s not like that because our boss is Congolese. We meet different Africans here. There are also Congolese from Congo Brazzaville. There are two Congos: DRC and Democratic Congo [Republic of Congo]. We are here with them, we meet here, with Ghanaians, Nigerians, we are in this together. We have become like family. We’ll meet. We are not just Congolese, but all Africans.
[i] Do you also have contacts with the German community, here in Bochum or in Germany in general?
[r] In the city of Bochum I am in contact with the people from my work. [she laughs loudly and for a long time] I have contacts with my relatives from my work. Above all, they like me. Because I’m also very nice. I like them when I’m there, …, even my boss, She loves me very much. My boss [name] likes me a lot. When I meet her we often talk to each other, we hug each other, I meet the [name] there, the [name], … We are there together. There are contacts especially at work, We get along well with the people at work.
[i] Can you please describe your work? What do you do, what is your job?
[r] I work for the elderly, I work with elderly people I clean for the old people. The old people are nice to me too. Definitely I like this work, I like work, even at the end of the work I don’t get tired. Because if you don’t like a job, If you don’t like a job, you won’t do it satisfied. Oh, if you’re not liked at work, you won’t like this work. But at work I am loved by old people and I love them too. I do the housework there very well. Things are going well, the work is done well, I also do the work cleanly, there are no complaints because I do everything well. It is also a place where it is private. I didn’t get the salary there in Stuttgart. I also did work there for the same amount of time, but I didn’t earn that much. This is where I got this income. That’s how it was in Stuttgart; I always worked full-time. But sometimes you had to work somewhere else for an additional two hours. That’s what I got in 380. But I surprised myself that I get 450 for 2 hours here. In any case, it’s the first time. That amazed me. This is the first time.
[i] Thank you very much. They are satisfied with their work. Do you have the opportunity to speak German there? So you can improve your language?
[r] Yes, I only speak German there, because only German is spoken there anyway. There I found an African. I had found an African there but we can’t speak in our language because we will make people uncomfortable. I speak what I can speak in German. I speak at work. I work without pressure, when I come I know what to do. I’m sometimes told what to do. [name], if something is missing at work, please tell us, we will prepare it. In any case, I take this job as my home. When I’m there, I’m very comfortable. There is no one there who bothers me.
[i] Do you want to take a break?
[r] Later
[i] [name], let’s continue with our interview, we will ask you to compare your life in Kinshasa and from here. You can say for yourself about the district. Life from there Do you also find this here? Can you make a comparison?
[r] Life in Africa is often outside, the people are outside there. We often meet outside, but it’s not like that here. Life is often at home here. Sometimes we meet in church. In church we listen to the songs that we sang at home. But a difficulty we had before, When we came, there was no church in the sense of our homeland. We didn’t go to church we hadn’t heard the songs either, besides there was long distance between people. Your acquaintance can be assigned far away, and then you will not have the opportunity to go to him. This may also mean that you are not allowed to go to his city. If you go there you have to pay a fine. Or will you be arrested. It was hard. But today we managed a bit. Today you can visit your relatives. It was particularly difficult with the food, but today there are African shops. We hadn’t eaten to our liking. We had eaten something we were not used to eating. Because African food wasn’t available here. But today it’s better, there are African shops, we eat local food that we call “Pondu” [cassava leaves]. We eat “fufu” [cassava porridge]. Really today we are good. But life is mostly at home here. In Africa we don’t stay at home, you only go home if you want to sleep. When you go out, you’re gone. [she laughs] But today it’s good. But at the beginning there was difficulty. Those who are coming today, those who are new, will not encounter the difficulties that we had. They’re a little better. Things are better now, there are African shops. For example, here we have an African shop run by a Pakistani. You can find Congolese food there. We’re fine, we’re eating well. There is palm oil, you can even get body oil, which we always use. If you think I’m beautiful through the camera now, it’s because of this oil. If you compare when we came and now, we have changed a bit. We have changed. Now you can go into the shop you can buy a powder there that suits your skin. We used to shower then use your oil. That didn’t fit but today we are good. We really found each other. God bless you, you should continue to develop yourself. Thanks.
[i] Except the food let’s take music for example, Christian or just ordinary, your culture, your customs, your African clothing, if you want to buy. what are you doing, Are there any shops that offer something like this? Do you have to go far, or do you get close?
[r] We, for example, wear loincloth, you often get that in France and Belgium. Rare to find here. But pants, dress, We get these here. In H.M you get a dress, Pants. It’s often cold here, loincloth are often worn in summer. The loincloth is sold in France and Belgium. Belgium isn’t far either. You’ll be there in two hours and you can buy your loincloth. It’s good for clothing in general. Above all, they set up Tekemax here, oh no, we found out. If you’re there, you can sometimes get a dress for 10 euros. It goes well. Here you can buy shirt, shoes, pants, pants, it’s no problem. We buy all of these, only “African fabrics” in France and Belgium. They are worn in summer. We don’t wear African fabrics much here either because of the climate. It’s often cold here.
[i] We know that Congolese often beds. There is a lot of church in Congo, even in Kinshasa. In Kinshasa everyone knows which church to go to. Here in Bochum do you have a church, where to find the spirit of Congo? Here in Bochum and also in Stuttgart. Or have to go far away to sleep, or stay Do you have to stay at home because the church is far away? Talk a little about our church. Receive Do you have the opportunity to sleep like it was in Congo?
[r] In any case, Above all, I found myself in Stuttgart. We had a church and I stayed there for many years. We asked in Stuttgart. There are also African churches in Bochum. There is also church. But now I haven’t visited these churches yet, I want to go because the church includes a whole life. You don’t just go to church like that. Before going to church you have to pray first God will show the place where you will pray. Like I don’t just not go to church. At present I am still at home, I am sleeping at home, the day God will tell me where to go, I will go there. But in Stuttgart we had a permanent church and we stayed there for years. But I only stayed here for a year and a half. God hasn’t shown me where to go yet. But I tried to go to a church in Düsseldorf. I went there three times but I found it too far. But I pray to God to show me a church nearby where I will go. I’m Kristin, I like God, I like beds, I can’t stay like this either. I have to go to church. This is mandatory. You have to acknowledge God because he had made us. You should acknowledge the one who made you. It’s good to sleep at home alone is not entirely good, sleeping with people is better. Because they say, a wood can’t get the food to cook, you have to have several woods.
[i] Now that we’re talking about the church, I know it’s in Congo have many churches: Protestant, Catholic, Christians from Europe in general. Here too, go to churches run by Germans, No matter Protestant or Catholic, because I don’t know your faith. Have you attended any German churches?
[r] I haven’t left yet, but when I see her I will go. I’ll try to go and see how they’re made. But I haven’t seen it yet because I’m still a stranger here.
[i] And in Stuttgart?
[r] In Stuttgart we gathered together with Germans in a church. A pastor named Willi Maier was with us. He knows me personally. When I was married, Pastor Willi Maier blessed my marriage.
[i] Willi Maier from the Evangelical or Catholic Church?
[r] It was the Protestant church, the Protestant church.
[i] Can you make a comparison between the Protestant church here and in Congo, as you noticed? Can you please do a comparison? So that people who don’t know who haven’t been to Africa can know what the church is like here?
[r] In any case, [she laughs] I ask your forgiveness, we once received Renard Bonke in Stuttgart, he is German. Renard Bonke God sent him to Africa as a pastor. Renard Bonke is German, I don’t know…, he is German. This German had come to Stuttgart, he had carried out a campaign there. There were a lot of people there, he had said to German: I am a pastor in Africa, in a country where English is spoken. He said how Africans pray to God, we white people will not reach this place. He said African understood who God was. You won’t reach there. Africans have a hard work, Africans suffer, but they take God to a level. We have money here, our bank accounts are full. But we are not far with God yet. If you go to the German church, even when we got together with Weiss, we taught her something. We taught them fasting and prayers. They loved us very much. Our church there was built thanks to a Pastor Sony. He came from Congo. When he saw that we had rented the church building, he said that the German people are a rich people in the world. People are afraid of them. The economy here is very high. How can they rent a church for God. The whites had collected money in a short time and a church was being built. We had shown the Weßen how we make bed. Because the African recognizes, above all, the Congolese, God. When you pray with white you realize they are not hot. We wanted to transfer our warmers to them. Beds from us and from white people are different. We seek God in Source. We do not see our suffering, for us God is only God. The white people raised money and the church was built. We helped, we cleaned there. The church was built thanks to Pastor Sonny’s word. I had lived that myself. We were there. The pastor Sonny is African, he comes from the DR Congo. The church was built thanks to him. We had gathered with white people, we had shown them fasting and prayer. But going to church with the white people isn’t a bad thing. But hearing God’s Word in your language is very important. Because God’s words are life. The German language is a language that we were not born with. It may be that you are preaching and you don’t understand a word, it doesn’t work so well. That’s why we Africans gather together to understand the Word of God in our language. When we gathered with them is at the end two services were held. We prayed in the afternoon and she prayed in the morning. We broke up because of the language. That’s how it was. But we were in the same building. It also happened that one day we had a church service together. The German language is not easy. She is heavy.
[i] Thank you, we are still in the process of comparing, we have compared the church here and from Africa together. In Africa the church services last longer than here.
[r] Yes. The service here doesn’t last long if it were the same country if I spoke French because we have a French speaking country, in Congo they speak French. We have mastered French, if it were the French language there wouldn’t be a problem. This is a language we have not heard since birth. We only heard them as adults. It’s not that easy. Hence the need to separate us because of language. In addition, the white church service doesn’t last long. Ours lasts a long time, we can only worship for an hour. We just sing, but the Germans don’t do that.
[i] You have just compared the church they have lived in Germany for a long time. You had a child here, I suspect that you know Germany somewhat well. You were born in Congo. They are there for school gone. That means they also know Congo very well. Can you compare the two countries: Germany and Congo. For example, the population, how they live.
[r] Look Africa has its way of life. Africa has its way of life, Europe also has its kind. How I was born there I came here. When I stayed here in Germany for a long time, I also returned to Congo. I also did a lot of traveling in Congo. But when I returned to Congo, is life in Congo as I have seen people really don’t live. The difficulties are great. Just food… Because here in Europe, eating is easy. Eating is difficult there. The children have no school and there are no hospitals. Everything is on the ground, everything is down. Where things are so difficult, people’s mentality gets in the way. At present, people no longer think, people no longer think well, because of the difficulty. After I go there I will make a donation. To compare Africa and Europe, Europe is on the ground. Sorry, Africa is on the ground, if you go there, because I have compassion, I give it there. If I have to travel to Africa, I even go to Diakonie, I buy a lot of things. I was already known in Diakonie Stuttgart, if I went there, Sometimes they even gave me 50 pieces of children’s clothing for 2.5 euros. I had actually bought children’s clothes and packed them in boxes. I’m looking then the money for the shipment. There I will her because the difficulty there is very high. You can find children on the street walking only in shorts, without a shirt. The difficulty is high. To compare Europe with Africa, you can’t because we’re here eat in Europe. In Europe we eat, Let’s drink, the children go to school, If you are sick, you get good treatment. No no, you can’t compare. Europe is high, Europe is high. To conclude, Africa is suffering.
[i] They come from Congo, they say Congo is a rich country, Congo has fertile soil, you can plant endlessly, Congo has natural resources that many countries need. It rains often, there is enough water, there are fish. But why do people die of hunger?
[r] People are dying of hunger, even in our country, our country has natural resources that the whole world does not have. Above all, we really suffer because it is a country that many countries in the world want. Since the countries of the world fight over this, these countries take 95% of the country’s natural resources. We stay with 5%. What can you do with 5% there? The world fights over natural resources, They take our things, they don’t feel sorry for us. For the world even they wish that the Congolese population no longer exists. and then a new world would be founded. Also our president who was in our country, he appeared two days ago, I think, He was supposedly Rwandan. He was not Congolese. He had sacrificed the land. He had no pity for the people. Things will be good in the country if they have a good president have. Because the president is the head of the state. If he has a good heart, the population can live somewhat well. You can live a little well, Firstly, we had a president who was a foreigner, secondly, he didn’t have a good heart, it was the cause of the suffering. I don’t know, since I was born, I had only seen suffering in Congo. When I return there, I notice that the suffering is increasing. There are many sufferings. A country where people pray a lot, people suffer from…The country has good soil, if you plant vegetables, cassava, or other things, they grow very well. But suffering still prevails. There are no hospitals, people die a lot. Hospitals lack beds, sick people don’t have a bed to sleep on. Women bring children into the world and have no money to pay. Hospital becomes incarceration for them. So…. It’s not our fault. It’s their fault World. They even take our natural resources for free. If they would let us sell these natural treasures, I think then, There would be buildings there that would be better than Europe. So the world doesn’t want anything good from us either. The difficulty that exists there is it that other people cause this, but not ourselves. The people there don’t think well because of the suffering. If the world would take pity on us and let us and the presidents would organize the country, The population could live better there. But God is God, everything in its time.
[i] As a mother, as with the experience you gained in Germany, They were also in Africa, You saw how people live there. If you would give advice about authority or would give advice to Congolese people to change life there a little what can you tell them? Things can change too when we, people, advise relatives.
[r] What I can say to our leaders, if you are president of the country, you are like the father in the house. We Congolese are your children. Which father can allow his children to starve? Father be with a good heart. Father hear the suffering of children. Also the world I don’t know, whether we Congolese damage things when we go to other countries. I don’t know. We live here now, I’ve lived for a long time, but I haven’t been to prison yet. I didn’t touch anything bad. I believe if you would follow my cause, Am I good, I didn’t do a bad thing here. I live quietly. That’s why the world should let us, the presidents from there should think carefully. They are the fathers of the states. Like today we have president Get Tshisekedi. Our eyes are adapted to him. Let’s see if he’ll misbehave in exactly the same way. Or will he do better. But since we pray should we pray for him So that your heart remains good. He should drink cold water with it he looked at the children that God had done near him. Because he is like a father, and we are his children. He should have pity on us. Because the suffering is over. Where will we go with suffering? We were born with suffering, grew up with it.
[i] Thank you very much, let’s stay in the city of Bochum. When you came to Bochum, message or you came with family. What help did you get in Bochum? Which people helped you in the city? Is it with the authorities or in normal life?
[r] In any case, when I came to the city of Bochum, I found the Bosangani club. [she laughs] When I was walking in the city I met an African. I saw my African relative. So he had told me that …. I had started asking him. I said: how are you? Then he had answered me in my language. We come from the same country. He told me that we have a club here that also helps. Then he had taken me to Bosangani. In Bosangani I met our father Massakidi. We once went to an event in the city, which I liked because I saw that the mayor of this city is humble. We took photos together. [she laughs] I took photos with him, we took photos with the mayor of this city. That surprised me. This surprised me, we took photos, he is humble, he talked. We took photos, I thought it was good, I liked it. We all came together. He came to us, he took his time, he also spoke to us, then we took photos, that amazed me. We get along well in our club, we meet here, we have a good time. They also help with authorities, that works well. It could be that he drops his case… For example, one day Old Massakidi accompanied me to the doctor, he showed me the doctor he had taken the time there, [she laughs] I was treated, then we came back. [she laughs] It’s good in any case.
[i] Thank you for the confirmation about the city of Bochum.
[r] I was happy.
[i] Coming from Africa, we often have prejudices. Prejudice means that you imagine things that are generally different. This can also happen. When you came to Bochum from Stuttgart, your expectations were as you thought.
[r] I’m also looking for the Diakonie in the city of Bochum, I know that Papa Massakidi will take me there. He will take me there. I would like to get vacation in the summer as I usually help out and these kids know me… I also have a project to set up an NGO there. I know that Papa Massakidi will bring me. I haven’t yet because of that suggested him to show diaconias. I will also talk to people from Diakonie, so that they can bring the prices down for me, like it was in Stuttgart. I was known in Stuttgart. When I was there They gave me the clothes cheaply. There are already worn clothes. People bring it there as a donation. I need donation.
[i] Which NGO do you want to found? Can you explain your idea, want to do NGO in Congo?
[r] I want an NGO found that the old people help children without parents. These children should go to school they should get dressed, get shoes. Because some children in Congo run barefoot.
[i] She wants to take donations here and bring them there.
[r] I want to take donation here and bring it there
[i] Please explain your idea with this maybe you can get help in the side of the people you will hear who are here?
[r] I need Help from many things How notebooks, for the children there. Notebooks, pens, clothing, children’s shoes… Many things.
[i] Congo is big, In which city or district do you want to found the organization? In Kinshasa or in province in Bas Congo?
[r] I wanted to go to the provinces, I will need machines in the province. For example sailboat engine, I will need that. If someone has that, they can also give it. I will do this even on land I need engine from ship.
[i] Thank you for the help to the population, because NGOs, even here in Germany, play a big role in the country. They do little things that sometimes the city can’t do.
[r] They also have to look for money, these NGOs.
[i] We will talk about this later. Let’s talk about the location of apartments. Where you were when you came to Bochum had had difficulty getting an apartment, or Didn’t you have any difficulty?
[r] What surprised me what I saw in Bochum I got the apartment easily. Because we came from Stuttgart, and housing there is hard to come by and they are expensive. All the time I lived in Stuttgart, Money, ah, when I was working I only worked for the apartment. I only worked for the apartment. But the apartment I got here. That’s how it was, my child called, I got in town. I live on Viktoria Street. I live with my child, although the apartment is small for both of them. I still want to change. I’m looking for another apartment. But we got this apartment easily. I even asked God: God what have you prepared for me in this city? Because I got the apartment effortlessly. And the apartment is in the city center. Although the apartment is small for me, the child and the grandson. The apartment is small, but we got it easily. We got it easily, which surprised me since we hadn’t paid a deposit for it. We were allowed to move in without a deposit. No. That was a surprise for me. I find relief here in the city of Bochum. I found the apartment easily. Must see where the apartment is located, in the center and not far from the train station. That upset me.
[i] What steps did you take, did you just call
[r] My daughter called. She saw the apartment on the Internet. She looked on the Internet, then she called, then the landlord said that we should come. When he came, he saw my daughter, showed the apartment and said if you want the apartment you can move in. Very light. Because where I came from, you can’t get the apartment like that. I found this very easy. I find the people of… relaxed. I think she’s very nice, that can’t happen in Stuttgart. Although this apartment is small because I still have to change.
[i] As we hear that it is difficult for foreigners to get an apartment here in Germany, especially Africans they have a hard time getting an apartment.
[r] I had seen this difficulty in Stuttgart, but not in Bochum. Maybe it was just luck that could only be luck. Maybe I’ll come with you to the second apartment Difficulty encountered, but it wasn’t like that with the first one. That was lucky, God allowed it, that’s how it is. I don’t know. But I have to change because she is small. The apartment only has two rooms. I’m with the child, she’s already big. She is 24 years old and is still the grandchild, it is small I would like to change At the end of the month I will hand in my notice We’ll look for an apartment that’s a bit big.
[i] Now we have arrived, where we want to know how the residential situation is developing here. When someone new has come how you arrived when you arrived, how you were accommodated, or how were you accommodated in the family And how your situation changed until you are now in a stable situation?
[r] When we first came [she laughs] We were given an apartment. There were a lot of us. The apartment where I lived with my husband was definitely like a birdcage. That wasn’t easy. So greater difficulty. When we first arrived, we were welcomed, thank you very much for that, I said that at the beginning. But the way you accommodate people is not entirely good. Try to change. They just mix people like that. That really wasn’t very good. Besides, my husband had died in that difficulty. When I got a job, when you gave me the work permit, a law came and allowed people to work, I found myself a little bit there. Afterwards I rented an apartment and I lived with my child. Then I got papers, I then lived in a good apartment. Even the people who are coming now have these difficulties. They still have these difficulties today. This could mean that someone gets accommodation, but he doesn’t have anywhere to put his things. Many people put their things in bags and put them in corners. You should improve there. Try to change. It may be that many people want to go to work, but he didn’t get permission to work. How can one live? Try to change. A person is a person. Even give permission to work. When we started working here, we couldn’t speak German well. But we had worked. We had worked, My social assurances as he had seen me very nice. Did he give me a job? That was with the old people. I had difficulty with the language, but I went to work. We distributed food to the elderly. The food was on tape and we had worked. Social had given us work. We were six African women, but the socialite was interested in me and another woman named Marie Jeanne. She had given us work. She had the other one didn’t find her very nice. We had done this work. But all these people have already left. But today we stayed here, we have papers, we are a little good, for comparison with those who come new. They have little difficulty. One more thing which I think is bad here in Germany is to bring people to Schufa. You are taken to Schufa because he only eh had taken the telephone, for example at d2. Sometimes he pays regularly, but perhaps if he has had difficulty for a month, he will be sent to Schufa. This Schufa is done like this that many things will come to ruin for this man. You can be registered with Schufa because of your telephone, then later to get an apartment. But why this relationship between Schufa and apartment. The landlord wants to know whether you have Schufa. That will be difficult. It shouldn’t be like that. Now you can’t get an apartment, he has to stay outside because he has Schufa. The man works and he can pay for his apartment, and what does that have to do with Schufa. Please sort this out here. That’s not okay. Sometimes you leave to borrow something in store, it doesn’t work. This Schufa follows you to business. This is not good, this needs to be improved. This is going to be like a mistreatment here. This should be regulated. We are human. You shouldn’t do that. We are human. But we as you come to Africa, the Europeans who come to Africa, we do not do the same as you do here to us. Why are you doing this to us? We are all human, please allow us to do so. Forgive me if someone comes, even if they don’t have any papers yet, they should get good conditions. We ask you in the love of God. Let it be said, we all came from the same place. We are children of God, we are from the family of God, I asked you in the name of God. Really we should be good, Put people in a good location. That could be the people who are new, want us to help them. We, who have lived here for a long time. We who already have papers and are in a better situation to compare with them. They try to show us their suffering. They think we have more money than them. But it’s not like that. When we are here we have no money. Demanding less of what we have that we pay for the apartment and buy the food. It’s everything. We are also waiting for the time of the special offer for clothing. Sometimes you buy clothes for 10 euros just to cover your body. Try to regulate the position of the newly arrived, You shouldn’t wait that long She and had held for a long time. There are people who came at the age of 40. He will be given papers after 10 years. You have disrupted this person’s life. When he turns 50, then after 10 years he has the pension, So it’s not good When people come, try them papers a bit to give earlier. You should have pity on them. Please open your heart, If you open your heart, God will Add something else big to your life.
[i] Let’s talk about your neighbors. Do you have contact with your neighbors where you live?
[r] Eh, where I live, eh, I have a neighbor he is Syrian, we get along very well. But we have a wife, we live on the third floor. A woman lives on the second, she is as a caretaker, she is a bit complicated, She tries to be a little disruptive, but I I understand that because she is pretty old. I don’t deal with her. But everything is fine with the neighbors. Nobody bothers us here.
[i] Talk to neighbors, help each other, or what?
[r] We definitely have good contacts with the Syrian, we also go to his apartment to drink coffee, we talk to each other. He tells us about his experience in Syria. He was a tailor, he had workers. We often talk about our homeland. He made me laugh. He also took B1 and passed. [she laughs] He’s very nice. He feels sorry for his country because of its disorder. Disorder reigns in the country. He tells us about the war in his country. His work is destroyed. He doesn’t work here. He says he was looking for work but it didn’t work out because of the language. He doesn’t understand the language well. So he’s home. I also told him about my homeland. About the killing among us. Dictatorship reigns in our country Congo. You can’t speak out, otherwise… The president who was there was a criminal. He had killed day and night. He had killed 12 million people. All people are afraid. They refuse to speak, to express their opinions. We are full of fear. That’s why we’re fleeing from there. When we come to your country, we also have stress. Here you will get a bad place to sleep. You won’t get any paper, the lawyers demand money day and night. We especially suffered in Stuttgart. We had a lawyer We distributed the money we got for food with him. This lawyer, I don’t need to give his name, he had tormented us. He knew we got 350. We had to distribute these 350 with him. That was a very difficult time.
[i] You said that there is a dictatorship in Congo. We know that you experienced the Mobutu regime. Mobutu regime let’s just say. Many people hear the name Mobutu, can you briefly talk about his regime? How was it then? When you were there.
[r] Mobutu was a dictator. He also destroyed the country. He didn’t do anything for the country. The people who were good, who had money, were from his environment. His environment because they became his close environment. His soldiers protected him. He was a dictator, but today the suffering has ceased. In his time people suffered. When he left power, the person who came after him tried to improve the situation, but that didn’t work. He died afterwards. But the one who came after him he made the situation worse. In the time of Mobutu it was hard too. I said it beautifully that since I was born, I haven’t seen happiness in Congo, haven’t seen a good life, There was no good income either. At the moment it has even gotten worse. because it’s now in Congo the people who work don’t get any money. There is no money, there is food, but people have no money to buy. Endless pain. The country has become dirty, there is garbage everywhere. Garbage causes illness you get no treatment, there are no medications. There are no hospitals, Mobutu’s regime was very difficult, he was a dictator. So what he said needed to be done, but not argued about.
[r] We have seen here that many people had fled the Mobutu regime, that was in the 90s, 80s years. Many people have applied for asylum in the Mobutu regime, they were students they were Christians what had he done what had his people done? How did his people behave when the students demonstrated? When churches demonstrate?
[r] They had killed. They were not allowed to demonstrate there. They had killed. Our head of state kills endlessly, no one can say anything about it. It’s not like here. There is justice here, you can’t just kill someone. But since in Africa they kill. If you demonstrate, you will be killed. It is not easy.
[i] Do you have contacts with your family in Congo, did you leave family there, do you have contacts with her, how are the contacts going?
[r] Many family members have already died, some were also killed. Some have died, some have been killed. If I go there I have to hide. Sometimes you drip them. They complained, they always suffer, they complained every time. They are in trouble, some are dead, some are alive.
[i] If you are also homesick, think about your country because you have left your country. You are far away from your country, what kind of homesickness do you have?
[r] Thinking, cannot be missed. your place is yours. Where you were born, is your birthplace. Really I think so. I think that’s why I want to start an NGO. This leads me to start NGOs so I can help. I need to start an NGO so I can help the children who are outside. who have no parents, I have to do this for her. The children who are alone do something for them. You have to learn, have something in your head. This is the reason. I like my country, I have to return. We have seen in the Bible that Nehemiah had returned. Nehemiah fled to Babylon But when he heard that Israel was destroyed, He had served someone wine, He was the president of… the king of Babylon he had given him wine. When he heard that Israel was destroyed, The king heard this in the village. He said why my village has become sad, He said my country is destroyed The king asked him what he wanted to do. He had replied that he wanted to return. He had said, you can return. He had returned and set his country in order. That was Nehemiah in the Bible. Nehemiah had returned.
[i] Since you are talking about your organization, and talk about the return, can’t you explain your organization, so that people get an idea about it. How exactly do you think how that should be.
[r] I want to make my organization like this I will look for a property I’m going to buy a piece of land, I will build I will host children there. There children will learn work, they will learn, they will get food and You will get clothes You are how I plan my organization. In life you should help. It is important. If God sent us to Europe today, to come here and see, God knows why. God does His thing with meaning. God does what he does for a reason.
[i] When do you want to start this organization?
[r] Soon, I want to set up the organization now and have it operational immediately. I want to be in touch, I want the authorities in Bochum to help me. I saw the mayor, he had seen me too. I speak to the mayor first because he is the first citizen I have seen. The mayor should help me since I saw you. If I’m going to do this, I’m going to invite a German so he can see my work.
[i] You talked about the Congolese society in Bochum, you talked about the Bosangani association. You also mentioned some German acquaintances. You also have contacts with German society. Are you also involved in other organizations, be they German or African? Except Congolese organization.
[r] I had that in Stuttgart, since I left Stuttgart I no longer have any contact. I would like to create a new contact here.
[i] Who were you in contact with in Stuttgart?
[r] I was in contact with… First, my pastor and other brothers and sisters. But I will still look for a German church so that I can still have contact with Germans. Because it is necessary to have contact with locals. I will link a German church here to contact her. I will look for a Protestant church. I will look for some Germans and get in touch with them.
[i] Now let’s talk about work, training and administration in the city of Bochum. First on the language side you had the opportunity to learn the language here in Bochum.
[r] I have the opportunity to learn, I like the language very much.
[i] You already have learned the language or are you still learning?
[r] I will continue to learn here.
[i] Which language do you speak to your family, German or your mother tongue?
[r] The family that is in Germany?
[i] Yes. With the child…
[r] With the child sometimes we speak a bit in German, sometimes in the native language in Lingala.
[i] To look for work in Bochum, you have Have you had difficulty or have you already tried to find work here? If so, tell us what that was like.
[r] When I came here I wasn’t looking for a job, but only someone contacted me. Someone came to me and asked me if I wanted to work. I haven’t looked for work yet. But I wanted to work. I was lucky that someone came to me and made me the offer. Since I like work, I accepted.
[i] What do you think for the future, what do you want to do in Bochum? What is your wish?
[r] In Bochum I would like to receive help for my organization. I need your help, so that I can help the disadvantaged children. Who is ready to go with me, can he accompany me too. He can also take part in the construction.
[i] [name], you are Congolese we know that your country, Congo, is a big country in the world and in Africa, the population is large, there is a lot of natural wealth. Can you talk to us about your country? maybe where you grew up, a which city did you grow up in, in which district, have contact with old friends do you have any old souvenirs? Do you know what you can tell about your country?
[r] My country Congo is the heart of the world, because all natural wealth that the world needs are in Congo. Such as coltan, cobalt, copper, Gold, .. They’re all there. But what does it matter my brothers and sister, that the richest country in the world of population are the poorest in the world where one finds severe suffering. Why this? If the country’s resources make cell phones, cameras, computers, it’s all made. That’s why we and you ask ourselves why now… Congo is a country that cannot lack anything. But why are we missing it? That’s the problem. The children don’t eat, they don’t wear clothes, they don’t go to school. But the country has a lot of money. The heart of the country, the heart of the world, why? As I have said here, I will repeat what I have said. You should open your heart to us, please. Whatever you do for this country, God will not be pleased with you. I ask you for forgiveness in God’s love. Forgiveness again in God’s love. Leave what you’re doing there. Because we know well that it is in 2021 Cars will no longer run on gasoline. They will travel with things that are in our country, Congo. That’s why you leave the Congolese If God had created us the Congolese, Does he know why he created us Congolese? It’s not like you have to mistreat us. The suffering, what we have to suffer, what we have to fill, we know where that comes from. Furthermore, we are a people who like God, who pray to God. The Bible tells us everything in its time. All the evil action we do are paid here in this world. Look how we suffer, for example I Mateta Makiese Lubaki live in the city named …in a commune called Ndjili commune. If you look at this community there are plots. In Congo we don’t have high-rise buildings. We don’t have high-rise buildings with lots of apartments in them. We have plot. The plots are big enough. We have no way of arranging and building these plots because there is a lack of money. My friends who were born on the same day as me, who were born on the same year as me, if you see them today, what they look like, you will have pity. They have become different because of suffering. Some have grown old because of suffering. I’m going to Congo, then I’ll meet her my childhood friends, they envy me. brothers and sister let’s, it’s painful. We came here in Germany. You welcomed us, we are guests here. Congolese doesn’t turn anyone away. We in our country have many foreigners, we don’t torture anyone there. Nobody rejects the Congolese. We also have a lot of Europeans there, they live well in our country. They live well in our country. I hope what you do for us here, Let’s not do this in our country. Let us also enjoy the happiness of our country. Can’t you take everything and let people suffer. That’s not good. We ask for forgiveness in the name of Jesus Christ. When you look at the country, it is very dirty. This dirt causes a disease called typhus. Added to this is malaria. There are many mosquitoes. You disturb this country, you steal things there, but also improve the country. Improve the country. Eh., improve the country.
[i] Is Ndjili in Kinshasa?
[r] Ndjili is in Kinshasa, I was born in Kinshasa, Ndjili is in Kinshasa, Ndjili is a beautiful commune. But when you see her today, how she has transformed, it’s a shame. There is garbage and waste everywhere, Water everywhere, no good toilets, there is no work, people are not paid,… really, anything is possible. The man goes to work tomorrow morning and comes back in the evening, but at the end of the month he doesn’t get any money. The salary of workers is around 70 euros.
[i] Can you compare the school when you went to school and the school now?
[r] When we went to school, in our time, we tried to go to school, we learned. For example, I went up to the fifth grade of pedagogy. When I didn’t continue school because my father couldn’t afford to pay for school anymore. I wanted to continue school, but there was a lack of funds. then we fled, we also fled because of difficulty. and many other things. They wanted to kill my husband, that’s why we fled. We had escaped in a bad way, it was sad. But God had performed miracles that we actually got this far. We had to cross many countries. Until we got here. God helped. When we were in school, the school would sometimes donate notebooks, but today we no longer have that opportunity. Congo has really fallen to the ground now. Every year there will be more suffering. Try to let the land breathe a bit. Because the country has a lot of wealth. I don’t know if God only put this wealth in Congo so that people from far away would come to get it. We ourselves don’t understand. When God gives wealth in a country, it is for the country. I don’t agree that in Europe it is like we are in Germany, if God does something here in Germany, I don’t believe that we who come from Africa will be allowed to take this thing. Whether you will allow that. Forgive me if I spoke badly. I just asked this question. But with us, the world comes from everywhere and they take things that are in our country. They cooperate with presidents, If you report it, you will be killed. You get up early tomorrow and You stay the evening without having anything to eat. When you get up you don’t know if you will drink water this day. Will you eat? Don’t you know. People are dying endlessly, where should we go from here?
[i] How do you find the life of foreigners in Germany in general?
[r] In Germany if you are a foreigner, you only remain a foreigner. Here a foreigner always remains a foreigner. In Germany a foreigner always remains a foreigner. We foreigners here have our laws. We have our laws that were made especially for us, foreigners. As a foreigner you remain a foreigner. But I don’t know, here in Africa, we respect foreigners very much. If you are a foreigner, definitely I don’t know how to explain this. You have a lot of respect. But here in Europe if you are a foreigner, you remain a foreigner, there are things you are not allowed to do. You are limited. You really are limited. We live with limitations.
[i] What changes would you like to see happen in Germany in, for example, 10 years?
[r] Even not in 10 years, we can start now, 10 years is a long time. As I said, when you receive foreigners, .. In the case that you reject them, it is different. But if you accept them, try to put them in something good situation. Maybe the pain we suffered here, maybe we could endure it back then. Maybe those who come now can’t stand it. Make someone wait for 10 years without papers…When someone comes, you should recognize them, put them on good terms, give them work. Maybe with work he can change his situation, he can get an apartment, etc. That’s how it is. We here pray for the relatives who remained in Africa so that they can get something to eat. Sometimes they have spaghetti to eat that we send from here. We buy spaghetti in LIDL for 40 cents. We pack them in boxes and we send them home so they can eat. We help with all needs. We send spaghetti, and. .. well, something else… Oatmeal for them to eat. It could be that you don’t have cassava, then he can eat spaghetti. It’s just hard. Although we came here, our thoughts are only established there. Sometimes you call your relative there and he tells you that he hasn’t eaten in two days. Such is the difficulty. But the country has money. We ask ourselves, what is it like, the country has money, And why are the population suffering? That’s the problem. The people who come there just steal. How long will you steal? When will they stop stealing? that’s the problem. We ask ourselves questions like these. You steal today, tomorrow and the day after, don’t you have pity?
[i] What message can you give to new President of Congo, Tshisekedi? for as a citizen from Congo even though you are far away, maybe he can hear you, if it happened like this today, that you meet him, what message can you give him if you get this opportunity? [deer, my brother Citizens of Congo, Tshisekedi, my message to you I think if we have suffered any more, because there was a stranger there. This stranger was Rwandan, but he was an African like us. We thought he could manage a bit well, but he didn’t do it. But you, a real citizen of the country. But Felix Tshisekedi President Tshilombo, my message to you: Please look back and think, suffering that the population has suffered, do you know that. You know there is a lot of work to be done in this country. elementary schools, so that the children can learn. Children are the forces of the future. Take the Kuluna give them work. Build apartments for them. basic work, because the Kuluna can work. You can give them an apartment in credit, only with their wages can you repay your loan for the apartment. So that they can leave their parents’ apartment. So that they can also start their own family. They have to start their family because the Kuluna, if they have become kuluna today, kill people with machetes and have no food. They don’t know how to get married. How to start a family. You don’t have a job. Please help the Kuluna, the disadvantaged children. Please take care of the country, keep the country clean, please build hospitals. All the things Kabila didn’t do… He didn’t do that because he doesn’t have a good heart since he had everything. He only came there because he wanted to serve his environment and his biological family. But he… Tshilombo, since you are there now, considers Congolese citizens your biological family. Furthermore, the Congolese, like us, should we love each other. We have to be together. If we are suitable we have a power. Tshilombo, look behind and think. Look how the citizens suffered. But as I see you, my father, as I look at you, do you have a good heart, I notice that. I don’t know if I see with which eye, but I see you, with a sorrowful heart. I know that your people will eat and drink, they will get treatment and they will go to school. They will move in and work. Thank you, that was my message.
[i] Thank you very much. I have completed the questions, you can complete so we can shoot. If you have something to say, you can do it.
[r] My last word is My brothers and sister: the Germans, Europe includes many countries, like France is Europe, Belgium is Europe, etc. Austria is Europe. But if I find myself in Germany today, God allowed this. I like you very much, because they welcomed me here. They gave me papers. The paper you gave me I can travel all over Europe with it. Thanks to you, They wanted to give me paper. You opened your heart to me. I feel good, I live in a good apartment, I live on good terms. Although the relatives suffer I speak first about what, i lives here in Germany. May God bless you, She should stay healthy, the economy should increase. This is my message, you are nice to me, I am nice to you too, you are good.
[i] Thank you Ms. [name],
[r] My name is [name], I’m fine, you’re nice, if you weren’t nice I wouldn’t have stayed here for many years. You are nice, you are good, you should be blessed, God knows why he allowed me to stay here in Germany. May you be blessed, God be with you.
[i] Thank you for your availability, see you next time.