SU_B_13

[i] Today is the November 21, 2018 I met with [name] to interview him. Dear [name], thank you very much for your hospitality and readiness for that Interview.
[r] You’re welcome
[i] Let’s start with the beautiful Instrument next to you that you brought with you? Would you please take yours? Instrument in your hands, let’s start like this.
[r] Yes, I brought my “Bağlama” with me
[i] When you came from Turkey, did you bring your “bağlama” with you?
[r] Yes.
[i] Would you like to explain to us why did you bring it? Tell us something about yourself and your instrument.
[r] First of all: “Bağlama” plays a very important role in our culture. That’s why I brought my “Bağlama” with me, I couldn’t separate from her because we all have songs and our lives We express our experiences and our pain by playing the “Bağlama”. until now that’s why I have mine Bağlama brought with me.
[i] You can hold while you speak, your gaze constantly falls on it, you can also strum on it
[r] Will you cut the pictures together?
[i] Yes I will. Don’t worry, the camera is already recording everything.
[r] My “Bağlama” I brought it with me because it is very important to us. For us has a cultural meaning. Our pain, our suffering and our experiences, all our realities, basically by playing we press on the Bağlama from, it has in ours Culture is important, that’s why I can’t let it go I always have it with me, that’s why I brought it with me.
[i] Who do you mean by “we”?
[r] By “we” I mean: I am an Alevi of Kurdish origin, That’s why it has a very important place in our lives. All the suffering we experienced we have in ours Add songs. I play and sing with mine as much as possible Sister who also lives here in Germany. You could say we share ours Pain with this instrument.
[i] That sounds nice. Thank you. You are new in Germany, when did you come to Germany? Could it be a year?
[r] I’ve been here almost a year, as you rightly say, I’ve been in Germany for 10 months. I’m currently taking a German course, I’m learning the local language, because I want to live here. I don’t want to go back.
[i] Why did you want to come to Germany in particular? Why not to another country?
[r] That’s a nice question. Everyone asks me this question. He laughs. I came here, because my sister is here. As you know, we are Family ties are important. My sister would take care of me, help me. Because as a stranger in a foreign country, it would have been more difficult for me. I weighed the pros and cons. So I came here. Mine Sister was very helpful to me. I have been living in this apartment for a short time. I moved in two weeks ago.
[i] Which city did you arrive in?
[r] I came straight to Bochum.
[i] You came to Bochum without detours?
[r] I came to Bochum Langendreer.
[i] You came exactly to where your sister lives?
[r] Yes, right there, where my sister lives.
[i] Then you probably didn’t have a very difficult time?
[r] I can say that I hardly had any difficulties because my sister’s circle of friends is very large, she has many friends. She has been for many years, seven years, here. She introduced us to they accepted me. I never have Feelings of alienation or Experienced difficulties/pressure. I made many German friends within a short period of time.
[i] By the way, you have this one Time to improve your German.
[r] Thank you ağbi [Respectful salutation].
[i] I actually wanted to do the interview in German, but I think so.
[r] We could have done it, but it would have been more strenuous for me.
[i] True, it would have been more strenuous.
[i] To make it easier, I decided to continue in Turkish.
[i] Tell us about your German friends. How was your first meeting? when you arrived. How and what do you feel, all in one Foreign country with a foreign language, culture?
[r] I can’t forget my first impression, my first step on German soil. Because it’s my first time Abroad and I realized again that I come from a very bad place. I come from chaotic states, crooked ones Houses, people in poor financial situations. My first impression of Europe was: I asked myself: Where am I here? I saw that there were rules and there was order. The people were not afraid. Getting to know Germans was made possible by my sister, my brother-in-law is German. I didn’t feel strange getting to know each other at all, I wasn’t accepted as a stranger either. Maybe because I look a little more modern, I wear earrings. Maybe that’s why, but of course there are People who make me feel like a stranger. As I said, I have mine Sister got in touch with Germans. We always had a very nice time. I can say that I almost never had a bad experience, there were very few situations.
[i] Can you do these rare ones Execute situations?
[r] Some Germans, I suspect many foreigners experience the same thing as me, look angry/annoyed. I was able to make such observations for example, my sister’s landlord. His attitude seemed hostile. He has a few times because of me Presence caused trouble.
[i] But he was a foreigner himself?
[r] It’s true, but the second one The landlord was like that too, he was German. I forgot your name, but it was a German woman. The second landlord now in Langendreer is German. She gave me problems and she wasn’t friendly, so she wasn’t friendly.
[i] So you say unfriendly? Have you also experienced bad things?
[r] I had a bad memory here. Even if I don’t remember exactly, I remember the feeling of being a stranger. In exceptional cases, but I experienced that feeling in the ten months. Why did you come here? As if their looks wanted to say: If you hadn’t come. Germans who don’t want to talk to you. For example, when I’m with German friends, When a young foreign man goes to a party, I feel the looks as if they were asking themselves: Who is that? I mean games with predominantly Germans. I found the looks questioning, that’s how it felt. 100%
[i] How did you in these How do you behave in situations?
[r] So I didn’t get angry or upset, even though I could have been. I tried to adapt, I couldn’t do much. I rolled my eyes.
[i] You have at the beginning Langendreer addressed you, you got to know Bochum in a short time.
[r] I got to know Bochum a little.
[i] In which streets of Did you live in Bochum? For example, you lived in Langendreer.
[r] I lived in Bochum Langendreer, I have friends in the near the main train station, I stayed in Lohring. I can’t think of many names, but I was often in Maarbrücke. Now I’m staying in Hustadt. I can say I have traveled to Bochum and its surroundings. I have lived in four to five different places.
[i] Where is the most beautiful place in Bochumist for you?
[r] To be honest: I think it’s the first one Place I think where my sister lived. Langendreer is very beautiful, I think it’s nice there.
[i] There is surrounded by nature.
[r] Yes it is surrounded by nature, the squirrels…
[i] Tell me about the first place?
[r] Langendreer is a heavenly place for me,
[i] Tell us about the nature there
[r] As you said it is surrounded by nature. I often have them Possibility to see animals. Rabbits, squirrels, it’s strange, I’m seeing such things for the first time in my life. For example, when I leave the house in the morning, rabbits are running around. The environment is very quiet. People are in the Rule calmly and respectfully. That’s why there was never anything annoying, there were no noises and no noise. It seemed like summer. In Turkey you have to be rich to live under such conditions. You have to be very rich to live such a life. I have seen that even a student can live like this.
[i] The problem is that not everyone can live there. For example, you would have to get the water from somewhere else.
[r] Ah, I see, of course there are these. You get water from somewhere else and you have electricity problems, we get electricity from you battery or solar energy etc. Of course not everyone can live there, but. There is a comfort there, that’s why you stay here, I can say that comfort suppresses the challenge.
[i] There is no landlord, no neighbor problems, almost everyone who lives there has the same thoughts. And people with the same structure.
[r] Absolutely, everyone accepts you. Nobody says: Why did you come here? Everyone there is “friendly”, friendly.
[i] Are you going there again?
[r] I’m trying on to go there on the weekend.
[i] Weekend only
[r] Right, in Life there is very difficult in winter.
[i] Is it cold in winter?
[r] Yes, we have to keep the oven running all the time. Constantly fetching coal, chopping wood when the wood is gone.
[i] As someone who comes from Istanbul, growing up, how did you feel about that?
[r] I was always with my mother.
[i] Then yours made Mother everything for you, suddenly you are faced with problems like oven, coal, Chopping wood, but also getting the wood.
[r] You’re busy carrying something, then the water runs out.
[i] Tell us what it was like for you on one To experience something like that in a place like Germany?
[r] It was like this: After about two to three months, I was shuttling back and forth between the apartment and this place. My sister has rented a second apartment. She has times in the new one house and once lived there. It was hard there, in The water runs out in winter. You have to go buy water. If you run out of wood, you’ll have to chop wood in the cold. You have to keep firing up the oven or you’ll freeze to death. The conditions were tough, but I enjoyed it. I associate Istanbul with mother’s warmth. I don’t know how to cook. I always ate the same thing here. Noodles. Fried egg. I found it difficult.
[i] Despite everything, you see it as a good start, right?
[r] It was very nice for me, that’s how I felt. I found the effort very nice. If I am among such Had I lived in Istanbul, I probably would have gone crazy. But for some reason I didn’t feel it here. I guess it’s because I achieved my goal of coming here.
[i] Which other place in Bochum is also very nice for you?
[r] Bochum Ruhrpark is a very beautiful place, the university, I always study there, in the library of the Ruhr University. There is a botanical garden. It is very large, there is even a Chinese garden. It’s very beautiful there. I relax there and read. For me it is the most beautiful place. I was there with my mother too. I like the more botanical one Garden very good.
[i] You are an artist,
[r] True
[i] How do you rate cultural activities? Do you have the opportunity to participate?
[r] I should have participated, as well as participated. Because I want to learn the language quickly, I have little time.
[i] Are you currently more interested in learning languages?
[r] Yes, very much.
[i] It’s understandable, if you want to live here you need goals, first you have to go to the country.
[r] Learn language, culture
[i] Learn language. Apart from that, what is Bochum’s nightlife like? You are young, your saz is in your hand,
[r] Yes
[i] You have earrings in your ear, What do people say about that?
[r] Yes, very interesting. People from our Cultural circles often say that I am versatile. I play Saz, wear earrings, dance in the club, this is also part of my life. I got used to the nightlife here very quickly. As I said, I have a page like that too. But I don’t participate much in nightlife, [name] ağbi, because, little by little, I found it silly from my perspective. I go dancing every now and then and have Fun, but I hardly drink alcohol. The young people here get drunk too quickly.
[i] What is the difference between nightlife here and Istanbul?
[r] For someone who leads a nightlife, there is not much difference. There are also many clubs and parties in Istanbul. Recently their number has fallen due to the targeted increase in the price of alcoholic beverages. The construction of a mosque on the Taksim Square impacts and affects all local nightlife and leads to closures. Normally there wasn’t much of a difference, but now there is The difference has become larger.
[i] Is there something in Bochum, that you don’t like at all?
[r] That’s a good question. So right now I can’t distinguish between beautiful and ugly. Everything seems beautiful to me, maybe because I’m new, maybe I’ll find something later. I can’t think of much at the moment. I was recently amazed to notice that people were walking together in large groups. Mostly people of foreign origin, I didn’t like it, that they go in groups. I suspect that’s the case everywhere in Germany.
[i] Have you ever thought about why that is?
[r] Of course I did, I even asked Germans about it. A younger German even told me that his mother was against being friends with a foreigner. Neither the Germans want to get closer to the foreigners, nor the migrants want to get closer to the Germans. Polarization arises. For example the young people. Arabic, Kurdish and Turkish Young people always walk around together. I rarely saw her with Germans. I don’t like that. For example, cultures are not intertwined. I think religion plays a role, then there are national differences. Here too, these things separate people from each other. Skin color, hair color as Separation difference seems silly to me. These distinctions should no longer be made, however I think that nationality and religion make a difference. These differences also exist in Germany.
[i] From which page is it going out?
[r] I think it comes from both sides. One side says: I’m Muslim, I’m a Turk, or something else in order not to approach the Germans. The other side says they don’t want to integrate so we don’t want them either, so they stay away. My Turkish, Kurdish and Arab friends told me this. Not all, but there are those who say. I can’t put a number on it I’m talking about groups like this. As an Alevi Kurd, I get along very well with Germans. I have no problems. We get along great.
[i] Very nice, you are young, you are learning a language, there are many books on the table
[r] Yes
[i] Exam training. What level are you at at the moment?
[r] I’m currently standing between B2 and C1. I am in one of the highest Levels that are required in Germany. understand, speak, Listening comprehension and reading comprehension, is between C1 and B2. That’s how good my language level is now.
[i] What is yours Goal for the future?
[r] For the future here in Germany,
[i] Surely you have also noticed here in Germany Even if you don’t like it, democracy reigns.
[r] True.
[i] There is freedom here, you can do anything you want, provided you are not allowed to disturb others.
[r] True
[i] You can do anything Achieve goal,
[r] True
[i] As a young man, what have you formulated as your future goal? Where do you want to be in a few years once you’ve learned the language, see?
[r] Before I came here, I thought that I was in Germany will continue the music 100%. I’m currently doing light work, I will always make music too. I would like to do social work. I would like to combine music and social work to help people, because I have in Istanbul has suffered a lot, so I want to help people here who have problems. My goal is to be in Germany I want to study social work and at the same time I want to develop my music to help people. I have a goal like that right now.
[i] It is beautiful and pleasant, that someone who came here wanted to help other people despite what you experienced in your country. So that’s a happy thing.
[r] Thank you very much.
[i] We need active ones here People, people who think like that. This is the only way we can do this Change society, both sides. Your tattoo on that Poor piques my curiosity.
[r] Yes.
[i] Did you have it done here or in Istanbul? What significance does it have?
[r] I have everything in Let Istanbul do it. I learned to tattoo, I wanted to learn. I had it done when I was 17. The image is from Belkin Elvan, very important. I show it to the camera.
[i] Yes, show it to the camera.
[r] Here.
[i] Who is Berkin Elvan, tell us?
[r] This is very important for us because it has become a symbol. Belkin Elvan is an Alevi child, This child is like many all during the Gezpark protests took to the streets, basically using his democratic right, but in Turkey taking to the streets does not mean a democratic right, but on the contrary For the Turkish state it is a terrorist act that this child is shot by a police officer on Okmeydan [Place name in Istanbul] and the child dies. He was in a coma for about 40 days, I can’t remember exactly, he was in a coma for 40 days. And then that child dies. Of course everyone is for us Killed a symbol, but because he was shot publicly by the police, this reaction caused a huge response. There are publicly available camera images. He is of Alevi origin. It is very interesting that 12 People are killed in the Gezipark actions and 11 of them are Alevi Kurds.
[i] How old was this child?
[r] This child was 12, when he died, [15 years old] if I remember correctly. He was 12 years old and very young, between 12/13 years old.
[i] When did the Gezi actions begin? And what were the Gezi events about?
[r] The Gezi campaign started in 2013, I don’t remember exactly which month it started.
[i] In June.
[r] In June. In fact, it started because of one tree, a forest. People were already fed up and it was also an opportunity. The state wanted half of the forest in Taksim Destroy the park and build a building there, then I remember pictures of HDP MPs like Sirri Süreyya Önder. MPs from parties like HDP, CHP and TKP were against it. Communist Party of Türkiye. But they played the biggest role People’s Democratic Party [HDP]. I can say that. We stood in front of the bulldozers; some trees had been torn down. You’re not allowed to do that, it’s a massacre of nature. This is an important one Information for Germany because Germany’s nature is wonderful and protected. People who think like us also have respect for nature. That’s how it started, in a way people’s reaction grew. Sitting action was created, so that was the reason, the forest, the tree. Then the state used violence again. They used tear gas to disperse the people there. It kind of grew like an avalanche. Because as I said, the People were fed up. Either we, the crowd, would have overthrown the government, with all the people taking to the streets, or the pressure would continue. Then everyone came out, I had the impression 60% of the people were there, almost half of Istanbul was on the streets. In metropolises like Ankara, İzmir and Bursa was the same. There was an echo everywhere. That’s because we do Government system and the government doesn’t want. A tree started everything.
[i] The Gezi Park protests brought everyone together, the Kurds with Kemalists and Nationalists with Democrats.
[r] Absolutely. Islamists…
[i] writers and illustrators, liberal Islamists, anti-capitalist Muslims, Everyone was there. All opposition members who were against the government, except those nationalists and those close to the government, Everyone was there, anyway. Despite this, it could not be prevented. Why not?
[r] People have that Instinct of life like all of us. There is also an instinct of resistance, that we used. Every person of them. Some of them took advantage of many, the others went to fight against the state with sticks and stones. Some just screamed some artists made songs, I also made a song for the park. Some wrote Poems especially for the day, Some expressed themselves through graffiti, everyone did something but as I said, the state put a disproportionate one Violence occurred so that people died. After an intense week People noticed resistance. It won’t work, people will die. Then the news came, Berkin Elvan is hit in the head. Ali Ismail Korkmaz was beaten up on the street, he was beaten to death in a way that no human being should treat you. That’s why the child died of a cerebral hemorrhage. Ethem Sarisülük was shot in the head by the police on the street. People heard this and it was deliberately published in the press. So people got scared, We’ll die too, they won’t go. People retreated to their corners and now after those days in Gezi Park, Turkey has become a more terrible regime, in my opinion. Used by an incredibly repressive regime rules. It’s incredibly depressing. I had Berkin Elvan tattoo done 7 months after the Gezi Park protest. And I hid it. Of course I don’t regret having it done, but a few times some people saw it on the street and called me a terrorist. I just left where I was. Because the man who rules Turkey, he has Berkin Elvan’s mother Terrorist, called an atheist and asked the question, why did you Marbles placed in your child’s grave? He encourages his mother at a rally Booing Berkin Elvan, yuuh everyone said to the mother of a deceased child. There is such a thing hostility in Turkey. I always hid my arm because I was afraid, because I want to live, I have the instinct to live, but it’s hard to live there. It’s a political thing. That’s why I always covered it up. I am free now, I can walk openly on the street.
[i] Solidarity rallies also took place in Bochum for the Gezi protests. I remember it well because I was there. I wanted to ask you whether you met people here who showed solidarity back then? There are still various promotions.
[r] I saw people who showed solidarity, I still see people coming from the Türkiye come and I know some of them. Also at the Gezi Park protests, we didn’t see each other there, but I met people here with whom we were practically next to each other, who came from Turkey, I got to know some of them.
[i] After the Gezi Park protests, the Gülenist story came out,
[r] Yes After that, this time there are two From the side, right-wing terrorism leads to golden nations The Gülen community and the left are already in power It is always presented as terrorism. From both sides, e.g. B. People like you had to leave the country.
[r] True. People had to flee a place like Istanbul, whereas in the 90s People from Kurdistan were glowing, people are now coming from Turkish cities.
[r] True,
[i] Off Izmir and Adana
[r] Very accurate.
[i] For example from Istanbul. Can you tell us a little about what life was like and what you were looking for? Difficulty have you encountered?
[r] You raised a very important point. If I say I’m from Istanbul, Everyone says: You come from a modern city. A metropolis where everything is great, all possibilities are open to you. People start talking, but the reality is completely different, Istanbul is a big city. There are many suburbs. There are many ghettos. It’s crowded. The more Islamic the government becomes and the more Islamic pressure grows, this fascism spread everywhere. Not just Islam, but right-wing Islam. And it worked to all metropolises. Not only in Kurdistan, like you said, Istanbul, Izmir. People felt under pressure everywhere. And the solution to this is now the Gezi Park events. Then it seemed to me like this like I said it. This is a situation that we cannot solve With my tattoo to Example, I don’t have one in any metropolis, with this opinion, with this statement, it is impossible for me to work somewhere. There’s no way, like I said, I always had to cover it up. And for example, as an Alevi, I live out the Alevi culture. In fact, I lost my religious faith, and for years I couldn’t say that for me a metropolis means high-rise buildings. It is one Business opportunity, but if you have a left-wing attitude and you want to show it, no matter where you live, in Izmir, in Istanbul, no matter where you live, at some point you come here. And the people come, I think Europe sees it. Coming from Istanbul Right now as many as I see, including from Izmir. The most important thing is whether you can live your convictions,
[i] Of course it is very interesting, I notice that. journalists and academics, those with the government worked together, everyone Day praised the government, have to leave the country these days.
[r] Yes, I think they explain their reasons now, why they do that They change their decisions or? They went arm in arm for years Poor with the Gülen movement. When the government identified them as traitors, Gülenists came here and Erdoğan Followers stayed there. It is a very complicated event, that we don’t understand either, but. People like us have held their ideals high. It’s been like this for years. We opposed both sides. So nothing changes for us, we always want our freedom. This can happen to someone from a metropolis, it can happen in Kurdistan. I think that Mindset is important. Where you live is crucial, within the borders of Türkiye it can lead to problems.
[i] You still have a tattoo. It’s in the shape of a ring, when did you have it done? What significance does it have?
[r] Yes, this one. As I said, we come from a politically active family. We had posters of Yılmaz Güney and Ernesto Che Guevara hanging on the walls. We’ll have those later Poster removed. I had it made for the prisoners on death fast. In memory of the political prisoners who… committed the crime of “forbidden thoughts”. For me it is the most senseless crime in the world, the crime of thoughts. You don’t kill anyone, People who wouldn’t even hurt an ant will only because of her Thoughts locked up. Turkey’s history is already dark. For the people who are on death fast, I had it made for them: a barbed wire. Because they couldn’t be saved, It is meant to represent the barbed wire surrounding the prison. But I answer questions about it differently because I don’t trust them. It has no meaning I say it’s a wire, in fact it has a meaning, that is, it represents imprisonment,
[i] I assume there are no problems here?
[r] I have never experienced a problem here. Turkish nationalists living here ask when you see it, Who was that? Because he was a very well-known child in Turkey. Berkin Elvan I answer. For example, they end the Entertainment, I’ve experienced that often. One day they talk to you, the next day they don’t talk to you anymore. I have those had experiences. These are people, still defend Turkey. This is very interesting.
[i] I put it like this: You come from Turkey. You were forced to leave Turkey due to political pressure.
[r] I had to come
[i] Now there is a dictatorial situation there regime, with a dictator. And you come here, to the center of Europe. Here you meet people who were born and grew up here, enjoyed education here and who grow up with the German dictatorial past, which has been discussed for around 80 years, You have one History of criticism. And these people who go to school here, grow up with this history, These people feel with a ruler in Turkey Dictator connected, defend, support him, are against such people like you.
[r] I think it has nothing to do with family upbringing, because education in Germany is good. I know that bad and dirty history is shown in German schools. These children will be in their Families dented: You are a Turk. And you remain a Turk. Homeland, nation, Sakarya, Nationalism is injected into their brains. These children can’t leave this world of thoughts, grow up and always feel like strangers. I have observed this, and these children always experience an identity crisis, They are neither German nor Turkish. You are in between. I think it’s all up to the family, I know many families who are… Workers came here. I have peculiar ones had experiences. For example, when I was with mine Sister picked up a cell phone the boy who worked there was a Turk, he helped us. He asked me “Why did you come here?” What are you doing here? You have a beautiful one leave home. He asks me such a friendly but also ridiculous question. I answer that a good life wasn’t possible there, that’s why I came. How can you say something like that? And he got mad. Why are you here? I suspect Germans asked this question too. If you don’t like it here, I actually came here reluctantly because I wanted to see my mother there, my father, have a house, our situation is not bad. Despite everything, I came here So, there is one Reason why I’m here. Why, even though you were born and educated here, you probably even know English. Our training is so bad that only a few young people speak English. So if you think it’s so bad here, you can also speak Turkish, why don’t you go back? I answered. My work is here, I can’t leave it, otherwise I would return. Always the same Lie, it’s a lie. I will return, but he doesn’t return. Before this conversation started, my sister was there, a German friend hugged him and asked: “Hey buddy, how are you?” good, courage, he replied, then as the German ‘Friend’ was gone, the conversation went like this: He openly told us that he didn’t like these Germans. I assume he assumed we agreed with him. Then a discussion started. You just hugged the man, why are you acting like that? These are those Hypocrite, he boasted. Where are you from now? From Istanbul. Why did you come? That’s how it started, very interesting.
[i] That’s right, but you gave him a good one Answer given. There are many examples of this kind. They constantly offered paradise so that people could fight for their fatherland. There was never anyone like Erdogan. If there never was one like this, why are you here? If you like it here? Why do you live with a people you don’t like? This is double standards. Nothing else. In my opinion.
[i] Tell us something about your family? Is all yours Family in Istanbul? How many siblings do you have?
[r] We are two siblings. Mine Sister is 6 years older than me, [name] is her name. My father is [name], My mother is [name], My father is a real Alevi Kurd, my mother has a small mixture, her father is Turkish, her mother is Kurdish. My father is at the age of 11, because of the adverse living conditions and opportunities Kurdistan emigrated to Istanbul. There is always cruelty That’s where you should invest. They meet at work and get married. They bought land and built their own home using their own resources. My father is a worker, and my mother also later became a worker. Because we grew up in the city, we didn’t have to learn how to steal. We have always been workers, slaves. Another term for Worker in Turkey is a slave.
[i] But you’re playing.
[r] This is what I played. I’m just playing this Instrument, we don’t steal anything else. As workers, they were able to enable my sister to study for about two years. My sister came to Germany with the help of two Germans. They met during high school. She came to Germany met very good people. We still see them. As I said, my family is made up of workers. My mother is a pensioner from a hospital company. My father is still working, he still has two or three years until retirement. Despite the difficult conditions, they raised us. But as I said, the actual reason for emigration is that life was not possible in Kurdistan. Are they involuntary Emigrated to Istanbul.
[i] Where do you live? Parents in Istanbul?
[r] In Istanbul Sultangazi, Surroundings of the Gazi district. A district with predominantly Alevi and Kurdish origins population, a politically influenced district. There are many left-wing organizations there. Like the neighborhoods Okmeydani, Sarigazi. But unfortunately it is the last one No trace of it anymore. Because they have in the Public people killed. At the moment many clubs have been closed, and I am also active there. I distributed flyers and brochures and took part in the activities. There are also some “illegal” ones there designated organizations. But actually very legal, in my opinion. Unfortunately we lived in the Surroundings of the Gazi district. My family still lives there.
[i] What was your childhood like? Tell me something about your childhood?
[r] My childhood was bad, when I think about it. As a Kurd, Alevi, I always had problems. As an adult I have noticed this because as a child you see something different and forget what you experienced. But little by little you remember. In the fifth grade, I will never forget, we were in the religious class and ethics lessons, forced lessons. Turkey is certainly beautiful for Europeans because of its geography. Istanbul is a large metropolis, there is nothing restrictive about it. But it’s not like that. We were in religious class, whether it was There are Alevis in the classroom, the teacher asked. I neglected to raise my hand. Four children from the class reported. Such a question, such discrimination, exists in the underdeveloped countries of the world. I’m talking about five years ago. I was in the fifth Great, a small child. I couldn’t come forward and declare myself an Alevi. For example. So I’m only now understanding what kind of depression it caused me. That was very bad. That’s why I have from that 5th grade found my educational life to be bad, because of religious education. My father is close to the unbelievers, he prefers the Alevi way of life and culture. But he doesn’t care much about religion. That’s how we grew up. Make your own choice, but value it Education and school. He always told us don’t mix religion with anything else. But the religion course in school was compulsory. We felt in the Predicament. Especially me. They teach you to pray when you can’t pray it and don’t get the grade, you won’t be transferred. And I know the prayer, although I don’t want to now. It’s in mine Brain burnt in… As an atheist, I would rather know other beautiful phrases instead of prayers. That’s why mine went Educational life bad. I was kicked out of high school for political reasons. My criticism of the political and Education system led to expulsion. I graduated without going to school… I suspect this is where it will be Called a distance learning high school. I have an external one Training completed,
[i] evening high school
[r] I have Finished evening high school, I didn’t continue in Turkey because most of the teachers were nationalistic. The teachers became principals. That affected us. For example, the teachers were always late when we asked: Where were you? I was praying, I’m sorry, he said. 20 minutes late. There is such a thing Understanding of education. If you’re rich in Turkey, you can go to college. You learn foreign languages, not like in Germany. You can go abroad, you don’t have to stay in neighborhoods like Gazi like us. No matter how good you are, you’ll still get a terrible education. The system tells you: You are a working class child, it is clear where you were born and grew up, that is the education you are entitled to! Enough for you.
[i] How did the children deal with it?
[r] Good question. As mentioned, I couldn’t even say that I was Alevi. When I was in the 5th/6th grade, I told my family about it. They strengthened me to say it. When I was in the 6th/7th grade. Class began to say, of course there were times when I didn’t have any friends in the class. Because he was deeply Sunni. He made statements such as: You are not allowed to eat Alevi bread. There are very ugly ones ITAM against Alevis. The same against Kurds, because I am both, times two. In the Turk you are Kurd and Alevi at the same time, the meat, the bread of the Alevis are not allowed to eat. Be careful with Kurds, say nationalist families, for example, so I didn’t have many friends. As I said, we were raised to say what you think. Stand by yourself. That’s why I had few friends. It’s interesting: I lived in Istanbul until I was 25 and I couldn’t tell my best friend that I was an atheist. We grew up together because he is a believer. I know he won’t talk to me if I tell him. So much nonsense, problems due to the Origin and the like. You walk down the street, you walk into a cafe. In our Gazi district there is no longer the old political force, now there are police officers everywhere, Toma [water cannon vehicles]. They targeted religious ones Let people move there. Religious developers built new houses there, and allocate the apartments in a targeted manner. People who are very religious For example, you are sitting. Somewhere there are complaints about you. They say why they are here, There are definitely red flags going up here. Such pressure is built up even in our district. I know this pressure from Childhood: As an Alevi, Kurd. The question: Where are you from? I am from Malatya. From where exactly? From Arguvan. Ah, is there an Alevism? This question has been asked thousands of times. Now what is the purpose of this question? Too often. I would have to concentrate so that all situations would come to mind and there would be no end. The battery would drain. Such an event that everyone knows, I experienced that very small pieces
[i] You have this Music studio mentioned. When did you start there?
[r] Two years after graduating from high school, I started studying sound engineering music production. Academy of Modern Music on Taksim Elmadag Street. When I started studying, At the end of 2014 and beginning of 2015 I found a job in a studio. Music studio in Florien, During my time in Turkey I worked with many celebrities. I hardly have with them Photos because I don’t like that kind of thing. But there was also political thinking there, that followed us the whole time. It was always problematic Being an Alevi or unbeliever. I couldn’t tell there. Bülent Ersoy [Türkiye’s Diva] came over. She is a transsexual woman. At the same time, she says she is very religious. A contradictory person, How could I tell her? In conversation she asks: Where are you from? People always ask this in Turkey. Where do you come from? Aha! For Ramadan they ask you, even in the studio, whether you are fasting. A work area where important people hang out, a music studio, celebrities come there. They ask you these questions too and I felt very cramped for a while. On the one hand I wanted to leave, on the other hand, I had my job. I argued/argued with people, I was mentally exhausted. I was forced to constantly discuss faith. I said: You keep talking about Allah, but you do everything imaginable. I’m constantly in Discussions advised. Then they fired me. They fired me. Actually I wasn’t fired but also no longer called to work. They said we don’t need you. That’s how it happened. I had it in my head, so I discussed it with everyone. I’m leaving here, I said.
[i] What did you do at this studio?
[r] I worked there as a sound engineer. Yes, I worked as a sound engineer, I’m the man in the studio Artists’ voices edited on the computer. sound engineer, I’m thinking about doing the same thing here in the future. Open a music studio. I want to release songs with people, additionally.
[i] Good thing, you mentioned about celebrities: Who were these celebrities? I edited three pieces by Ibrahim Tatlises’ son. Ido the man’s son, who calls himself Ibrahim Tatlises. Mustafa Ceceli, the elite of the Celebrities in Turkey. They don’t have anything special for us Meaning but they take a high priority in the Turkish media. Mustafa Ceceli, Ido, Yilmaz Morgül. Bülent Ersoy, Niran Unsal, So I worked with a lot of people. I edited their songs. I did the mixes. I was able to access this Way to save some money.
[i] If you look at the lives of these celebrities, Aren’t these people who have nothing to do with it? Religion, have to do with Allah.
[r] No, nothing.
[i] Why do they interfere with your faith? Why are they questioning your stance?
[r] You don’t have an answer to this question. If we could get a reasonable answer to this question, you could say okay, but they have no logical explanation. There is none Answer to the question, there is the question but no answer, so no answer. For example, Irem Ünsal offered me a job in his Kavacik studio. When I was there, I saw amazing posters on the walls, basically nude photos. Photos in bikinis naked. In today’s reign, did this artist, a famous person, veil herself, in order to be successful. We say religious abuse. She veils herself all at once and she showed the public that is a real Muslim. I went to work with her, but I could only last 3 days. I could because of my Opinion stay nowhere. In Turkey. She organizes cocaine and other debaucherous parties. There is everything. She disguised herself Achieve goals, nothing more, but if you tell her, the employment relationship ends and you have to listen to how you dare question her religiosity. It is forbidden in the Tell Türkiye the truth. 100% forbidden. The truth is: they lead such bad lives. That’s why I couldn’t come to terms with it. With the justification, that I have parents. Who are these people? These disgusting people. I didn’t stay there. I would go crazy in Turkey.
[i] How long did you work at the studio?
[r] 3-4 days at most. I couldn’t even work full time on the fourth day. I took my money I said I didn’t want to and left. Like I said, I was exhausted at the time. It was clear: I no longer had anything to do in Turkey. I understood that. Even people educated by your standards even became proponents of it government in order to live. It has changed. If you want to live a reasonably comfortable life in Turkey, you have to approach the state. Under no circumstances should you betray your attitude.
[i] Were you unable to work with other oppositional artists?
[r] There were the possibilities they come here too. The reality in Turkey is that that even the oppositional person as an artist faces someone close to the state artists would not address these topics. Before you I throw A pro-government artist. Everything is kept secret. I didn’t get to work with them that often. As I said, they focus on their work and their wages and try to live their lives without giving their opinion much away. They are also under pressure. Because that’s how they have to make a living. If you look at his opinion exists, they will definitely lose their job. Many artists are denied spaces. At community events or concerts there were some arrests. Baris Atay, an actor, was arrested several times. It is difficult. Honestly I barely had Opportunities to work with them.
[i] Since your how manyth Have you been playing Saz for years?
[r] Actually only for 2-3 years.
[i] Then you only started recently?
[r] I mean playing properly. For us it always depends on the Wand, I played it every now and then. At home on the wall.
[i] As a symbol?
[r] Symbolic, but you also strum it. My grandfather also played it. Because of this
[i] Does anyone else in your family play besides you?
[r] My sister. She plays Def and sings. She sings Kurmanci and Zazaish. Sometimes Turkish, sometimes Arabic. In all languages. Sometimes I play and she sings. Sometimes she sings and plays herself. My sister is also a musician.
[i] Are you performing here together?
[r] Yes in We performed in Bochum 3 to 6 times.
[i] Does both occur?
[r] Yes, just the two of us.
[i] Both of you alone.
[r] Yes, like a group. We formed as a sibling group.
[i] So you play?
[r] Yes, and she sings and plays her Dev. Good. What do you have plans for the future?
[r] When I reach my sister’s linguistic level, I will become more can communicate to people. And there’s this beautiful thing in Germany, if you want to do a project, the state supports you. He helps you, so to speak. Offers you spaces. We have the following project in mind: We want to make a compilation and travel to Germany. With pieces that the Turkish, include Kurdish, Arabic languages. I’ll play, she will sing. At the same time, we plan to become politically active. My sister will explain the origins of the painfully emotional songs and play them. We also have a project like this in mind. I will play a piece, she will perform. When it’s over I’ll explain the origin of the song. We have a project like this in mind. And travel to Germany.
[i] You have a nice plan. It’s different. Outside the usual.
[r] Comprehensive.
[i] Being comprehensive is, in my opinion, an important thing. It’s like that every song has its own beauty in the native language.
[r] Yes.
[i] A Kurdish song in Kurdish, an Armenian song in Armenian.
[r] For sure.
[i] It is actually the case, so that others can understand it, the meaning and content should be translated into German. I think it will be nice.
[r] We definitely intend to do that.
[i] And it shouldn’t just be left at that, but also archived. It has to be in this one respect.
[r] You’re right, brother, about this We never thought about the topic. Because there aren’t many of us have information. We couldn’t even think about this side. Because we don’t want to know about archiving, but maybe through you…
[i] In my opinion you could do something like this: You could do the following. In Germany or Europe you can use capital or support e.g. E.g. You can apply from the cultural office. From the cultural office. Or from municipalities. You can on municipal Events occur in your project imagine as cross-cultural.
[r] That’s right. We’re actually thinking about it. But. It is still a project plan. I have to do my tasks first. language and others.
[i] Leave something for your sister, who lives here is an artist. She recently got married.
[r] For two years.
[i] She got married. She has a German one Boyfriend married.
[r] Yes.
[i] How was this received by the family? [r Yes.
[i] How did you take it? What reactions came?
[r] As I said, we were raised openly. There is a saying: People are important to us. For us, religion is. Origin is not important at all. Is it a good person? My father didn’t say anything against it. Normally in Turkey it is for the The woman saw this as a catastrophe. We, my father said: Be good to my daughter, love her, that’s enough for us. I also don’t see it as a bad thing that he is German. We don’t have any problems. It’s pretty normal. There are some unusual cultural differences. And that’s normal. We grew up as a family. She is a bit more independent, stands on her own two feet, that’s how she was raised. There are no problems for us that my sister loves a German. Done, she loves him. We received it positively. There’s nothing bad about it.
[i] What is home to you?
[r] What is home?
[i] Home.
[r] Sorry, that I laugh. I don’t have any feelings of home. Is lost, doesn’t exist. Where I can live in freedom is my home. I think. If I have to say something about home, I can say this: Where I can live freely is my country. It would have been Kurdistan. But a place like that Unfortunately, as you know, it doesn’t exist. Now I live in Germany. Unfortunately, the concept of home is also because of assimilation in Turkey, linguistically. I don’t know Kurdish, that is very painful. So that we don’t become even more excluded, our family didn’t teach us. We couldn’t learn it. In contrast, my Turkish is very good. I don’t speak Kurdish, but I understand it a little. For me, home is… I could never feel this construct. I don’t know this feeling.
[i] What if we call it identity? So as an identity.
[r] Identity? I have always said with pride that I am a Kurd and an Alevi, but first and foremost I am a human being. Our origins are of course important, but that doesn’t mean that I as a Kurd another nation denies. I am Kurdish and Alevi, and I am open to all people. And love all people. My identity: I am an Alevi Kurd. After: I am human. That’s how I always put it.
[i] How do you use your free time?
[r] I do a lot in my free time. I mostly learn German. In between I play bağlama. Sometimes I go to the caravan site. About once a week. When I’m free. I take photos at weddings once a week. At weddings here in Germany. This is how I spend my free time. Of course I meet friends. I have many German friends. Even though I’m new, I have a lot of German friends. Both girlfriends, as well as friends. We sit together, go to events. There are many events here, then which we take part. It is beautiful. It’s in German. Music, Take photos once a week. Every now and then development. This is how I spend my free time.
[i] You have Germans Friends mentioned. With them you have none Problems you say.
[r] None at all. Not at all.
[i] I mean the early days. When you experienced the German one. How do you have the German one? perceived language?
[r] That was a difficult thing. Honestly, I thought I wouldn’t be able to learn it. I don’t know, Maybe everyone feels that way. The beginning is difficult, it has some difficult rules. It was very difficult. Incredibly difficult. That’s why I had a hard time. Especially building a base. A1 and A2 levels are very difficult, for me.
[i] How is it now?
[r] It’s good now. But if I I notice that I’m tired I can’t talk. I wondered if I was forgetting what I had learned. I was told that I don’t forget it, it was an effect of fatigue. When you’re tired, you even have difficulty speaking your own language. At the moment my German is good. As I said, when I sit with German friends I can have a conversation. I can express what I want. I can go to a specific one Writing texts topic. I probably brought my German to a good C1 level within a short time.
[i] Is there a difference if you compare your free time in Istanbul and here. What difference is there?
[r] In Istanbul my free time was completely empty. I couldn’t fill it. Because like I said, I kept wondering what I should do. With questions about perspectives, full of questions, I spent my free time thinking. There were no events. Just thinking. With questions about: How can I go somewhere, how can I change this life. In contrast, I use my free time here by working on a topic, learning, meeting people, Discuss with them. I am free. I play music. Mine free time is full. Full of beautiful. What strained me has finished, how can I put it: there is nothing here that puts pressure on me or messes up my mental state.
[i] So: How would you describe those living in Bochum?
[r] Those living in Bochum?
[i] And compare the people living in Istanbul/Türkiye.
[r] A huge one Difference, I can say. It’s like this: There is no reason, but in the streets there is violence, blackmail, injuries, insults. Strong smells. I have often said, but actually I may have gotten into a shouting game once. In Istanbul can be in front of yours Eyes of one die. They can stab each other in peace, one can be kidnapped, very easily, we often notice that. Shootings. We were already used to it, While we were drinking tea on the balcony we heard shots. Tak, tak, tak, pat, pat, pat küt, küt I came from such a life to such a life. For me there is a huge one Difference to life in Bochum.
[i] Are you ever Have you been in love?
[r] I was in love. That was bad too. You’re hitting the mark again. The reason why my first relationship failed was similar again. I was very much in love, thought of marrying her. I was 22 years old when we broke up. Your father found out from us that we have been together for two met us years ago. As I said, we are open people. What job she has and where she comes from plays a role. My father called her my daughter. My daughter also called her daughter. She could stay with us. We don’t have anything conservative. Her father found out about us. After two years. She had to tell him everything. We wanted to get engaged. That’s how we planned it. She told him where we come from. Who we are. Your father called me, threatened me. He demanded that I leave his daughter. My first love. Of course I was upset. I am young, impulsive, I went crazy. I scolded Another day I called him. I said: I would like to go speak to you. I apologized. I was angry. What is the reason I asked him. They demand it Separation, but why? I actually knew why. Being Alevi, Kurdish was the reason. He answered: No matter how hard you try, you will never succeed in my sight be the right one, that won’t work. He said and separated us. This is how my first love ended.
[i] How did it begin?
[r] Getting to know the girl? There is one in Turkey Competition program “Yeteneksiniz”. I took part in that. And I even got pretty far. She was a spectator. That’s how we met.
[i] What talent did you use to take part in it?
[r] I did back then Rap performed. I am very versatile. I also released a rap piece for the Gezi protests. The piece has many attracted attention. That is also the reason why I have fears.
[i] If it’s not very long, you’re welcome to recite it.
[r] As far as I can remember, I can recite the words. “Man dies, new one is born, your mouth opens, someone closes it.” “If you don’t resist, the state will kill you with a spoonful of water.” “If you don’t believe, see for yourself.” This is how it begins. Chorus:”Shoot, shoot, Shoot, let’s see.” “Shoot pepper spray.” “Take out your Kask.” “Put down your baton.” “Who is the youth?” It is directed against the police officers.
[i] It is provocative.
[r] It’s quite provocative. Towards the end I even used bad words against the state. That’s why I’m afraid. But it is still one of my favorite songs.
[i] How did yours Girlfriend reacted to that?
[r] She was sad. For them too, it was unimportant where they came from. She was very sad. It didn’t work. She even thought about running away.
[i] Where does it come from?
[r] From Balikesir/Bandirma. Strict nationalists. MHP [Turkish Nationalist Party]. It fell apart. What’s interesting is that the father is AES. That he drinks a lot. But at the same time he is religious. He drinks a lot. And is religious at the same time. He is…, a Muslim. How can you consider an Alevi, he asked. Very extreme He put pressure on her. It didn’t work.
[i] It was your first love?
[r] It was my first love.
[i] Was there another love?
[r] My second love was an Iranian Kurd? The story was interesting too. She comes from a Shiite religious family. I met her shortly before I came here. I had made the decision to go to Germany.
[i] Did you meet in Istanbul?
[r] In Istanbul Taksim. She came as a tourist. My friend knows her brother. My friend invited me to drink tea. There was a spark between us. She went back to Iran. Came to Istanbul again because of me. It was a time when everything was becoming too much for me. Her family was very strict. The Islamic regime rules in Iran. Sometimes I can’t remember Turkish anymore.
[i] The regime.
[r] The regime. That’s why we had Conflicts. But we loved each other very much. Even though we loved each other very much, I contradicted her. You’re so oppressive so we can be together, you have to change a bit. She came from an incredibly wealthy family. She never took the bus in her life. She took taxi or private car. For me it’s the opposite. There was one like that effect between us. I come from an opposite place. Girl comes from a very rich family and I am the son of one Working class family though this played an important role role in our association, When I told my life story, it sounded like a movie. She liked it. But like I said, she had a lot of rejections. It was good to be an Alevi, she is Shiite herself. It looks a bit similar but not, in fact there is no similarity. We discussed Ali and Shia, I said she was very radical, either you change, and do not despise people of another religion, we argued often, Our relationship wasn’t working. I ended the relationship because arguments made me nervous. She was very pretty woman
[i] You are still very young, you fall in love even more often.
[r] I currently have a German girlfriend. She said she loves me, I love her too, let’s see. I have a German girlfriend, who I’m currently talking to.
[i] I hope it’s a new beginning for you
[r] Let’s see
[i] Could third love, be your last love?
[r] Well I hope so.
[i] You talk about your future plans, but I see you have a lot of plans for your future, haven’t you said yet?
[r] So right, I will 100% make music. I’m sure I’ll study social work I finally combine both, I want to help people and At the weekend I’m busy with music. I want to help people outside of my job, to bring [integrate] them into society. I become more different to people Bringing origins together with music, in the future my first goal is to Second, I want to open a music studio. Later I will have a music company in Germany. I’m thinking of it, internationals to do business. African music and albums, Kurdish music, because we in our own Language not done in Turkey. We couldn’t, because it was forbidden. I want Kurdish Publish music albums. There are many artists around me in Bochum,
[i] You’re lucky because Bochum is a cultural city.
[r] I am very happy.
[i] So there is one in this regard Role, although not big.
[r] Absolutely I agree, yes. So I’m going to use it, there are a lot of different people here. There are musicians I know. I want to make and release their albums. First I slowly go to the basic horse.
[i] Do you have a dialogue with foreigners who come from Bochum and have the same hobby? Let’s take for example Artist. For example artists from different countries were made. From Latin America from Iran
[r] Correct.
[i] There are many Kurds.
[r] There are many.
[i] Many Arabs have come recently.
[r] Yes
[i] Do you have contact or a plan with them?
[r] It happened, there is an Arabic one Girl from Syria, Damascus. She also makes music, she sings. She knows the instrument Bağlama, who I play, I would like to do something with her. Otherwise I know a few African ones Young people who do rap. As I said, I’m diverse, I wanted to rap with them because young people here especially listen to rap. From what I hear and see, such projects. I want to rap with young people from Somali, with an Arabic one Girl I sing, I have something like that, I have a girlfriend, Her name is [name], born and raised in Germany. She came from Greece. The main goal is to work with them on a project. I’m doing this now Project with my PC. I organize various projects by people from different cultures.
[i] You are on a diverse and multicultural level.
[r] I’ll just say that I landed in a paradise. I don’t have any worries now, my only worry is, Learn German language faster so that I can do something straight away. That’s the only reason I want to learn German and so that we can communicate smoothly and more quickly. Being here makes me really happy.
[i] Good, very nice
[r] I also met you, our brother [name] A good brother.
[i] It was a very nice interview, Thank you very much for your time and patience. And he showed me this patience. Thank you very much for that.
[i] You’re absolutely welcome, I’m always here.