SU_B_06

[i] Good evening, I warmly welcome you to our Specially Unknown project. We are very interested in particularly unknown history and their life story. And from the people from Guinea we have a total of ten people and I am very happy to welcome them today. Lord [name], maybe you will introduce yourself briefly.
[r] Yes, I’m also very happy to be here. I am the [name]. I live in Bochum, I am married, live on Götterstrasse with my wife and I have been in Germany for eleven years now. I studied and work here.
[i] And what do you do at the moment? So at the moment, I am taking further training, so I take part in further training so that I can improve my programming skills in the direction of e-plan, electrics, autoCAD and project management.
[i] Yes, beautiful. As I said, it’s about your story. They show us, tell us what you and us want to tell. We are very curious. Now – I don’t know where should we start? With childhood?
[r] So, yes … I catch … Yes, that would be the beginning. So, as I said, I come from Guinea. I was born in Conakry. I belong to a family of seven – father, mother and actually five siblings. I have a twin brother who is a doctor. He lives in Paris. And I have four beautiful, so, small sisters.
[i] Hello, my name is [name], Field worker for our project Specially Unknown, which means something like particularly unknown. I am very happy to welcome you today. And we are very, very curious about your life story and we won’t talk about that long. From me we can start now. Can you imagine that briefly?
[r] I am also very happy to be here. [Name], I am the [name], I come from Guinea and currently live in Herne with my wife. I studied and worked here in Germany. I am currently taking part in a further training in E-Plan, AutoCAD and project management. So, as I said, I was born in Guinea, I belong to a family, father, mother and six children. I have five siblings, I have a twin brother, he is a doctor and lives in Paris. And five beautiful sisters, four beautiful sisters. I was born in Conakry and when I was still small, two years so, my father served in Kindia. He worked for the government, he is a civil servant. And we went to Kindia, so moved to Kindia. Then we stayed in Mamou for another year. That is one, both are two cities inside the country. And then we are back in Conakry, near Bambeto. The neighborhood is called, so the place is called Bambeto. And I actually grew up in this place. I am, I had the good chance of having such a good training. I say, we say one of the best schools in Conakry during this time. I did my school in Longo Unite, that is. And after school I went to college, so after Sainte Marie.
[i] Do you mean the elementary school?
[r] Yes, I did the elementary school in Longo Unite, up to the sixth grade. And then from the seventh to the high school, high school. I did that in Sainte Marie. This is a Catholic school. That was the best school in Conakry during this time.
[i] That corresponds to this secondary school?
[r] No, this is another school. So, yes, a school founded by Catholics. And I had also done another training. As I said, from seventh grade to high school. And I was a boy who, let’s say, were happy to play football. I was good too. But unfortunately in Africa, let’s say, in Guinea, with us, the parents … I do not know if there was a defect from perspectives during this time. But they didn’t like to let us play football. Every time we played football, there was trouble when we came home. I mean I and my brother now. But otherwise, I had a nice childhood. My parents both worked. And they made sure that we were not missing anything at home. And after school after my high school diploma, then I am, so I have a way to go to university. So the University of Polytechnik in Conakry. Then I studied civil engineering from 2002 to 2006. But as I said, studying in Guinea is more theoretical. And we hardly do practical things or nothing. And that’s why I decided, with my father, that I should visit a better university. Then we looked on the Internet, what could be there. So I had, I went to a friend of my father. He lived here in Germany. Also studied here. Then he told me that in Germany you have a good university. Although the language was of course a thing for me that I have never heard or came to speak. After that after this conversation, then he helped me to write to some university. Then we did that too and still universities in France. Somehow Aachen, the University of Aachen, was the first to be admitted. Then I thought, well, I’ll go. It will be a big challenge. The language first and then maybe studying will be different. Because in Guinea, we have the French system, it’s totally different here like here in Germany. Then in 2007, I think there was still unrest in Guinea during this time. The government had difficulties with the soldiers. And I think they had tried to make a coup during this time. And there was such a chaos that you hardly had perspectives in Guinea during this time. And then I decided to fly to Germany to study.
[i] beautiful. It sounds like a fairy tale book. Everything was very, from the treadmill, which programs a lot. Everything went very nicely and I’m happy too. We all are happy. Of course I might be there that you can see a little bit over time. So childhood, youth with whom you can remember. Can you from the neighbors or the free time you spent it? So I had spent my free time because in Guinea, I grew up in a Muslim family. That means after school, I should still attend the Koranian school. This is a place where you can then learn the Koran. Or the prayer that prayer can do. I was at school from 8 a.m. to 3 p.m. And then from 4 p.m. I was in the Koranian school. As I want to say, less for an hour or in the evening. And after that I went football. But in the evening we also had … I remember when I was still small, we say from the first to sixth grade, so we had house teachers who came at home and so we gave ourselves a few lessons in math or we say French. And that also helped us to develop us further. As I said, in Guinea, we have such a society where you know your neighbors properly. So I know my neighbors. I grew up with them, so children grew up. It may not be like here, where you can spend a month or a few weeks in the evening, without seeing your neighbors. So there with us, you play with the children of neighbors, you eat with those who eat with us, you sleep there, you don’t need permission or … That was actually a big family in one place, we say. So the family in Africa has such a context.
[r] Yes, just such a large family in Africa. You can feel at home with the others as well as with yourself. So the surroundings. That was a nice environment.
[i] I noticed the following. I always do things, things are twins. And I’m used to the fact that twins we, we, we. There was a separation or maybe that’s now …
[r] No, the first separation we experienced was when I was supposed to fly to Germany. That was the first separation. That was, that was something, the most difficult in my life. The first, I would say. So because back then, we always shared the same room. Same clothes, shoes. We did everything together, so like normal twins or even. Yes, he is my best friend and I was not anywhere without him. And also with him. And that was that day, I remember when we arrived at the airport. Gave, let’s say all friends from the place, i.e. from the bambeto. Everyone was there, but I cried, really. Because my brother was really missing. When I got on the plane, I just wanted to go back. Because I thought I was flying somewhere where I don’t know anyone. I even can’t. And above all, my half is not there. Because I see him as my half. And that was difficult. Mine, my first years here were really difficult. I wanted to have homesick. Wanted back. But as I said, I still had to attend the training, the university. And since my parents have gotten everything out so that I could make this trip.
[i] You mean financing it?
[r] Yes, exactly. Therefore, I should really repay that with a certificate. So that they can be proud of me. That’s why I gave everything to create my Bachelor and Master here.
[i] Yes, beautiful. I want again, I also find this childhood very interesting. Because there are also found stones. They told the neighborhood. And they are, once they told Kindia.
[r] Yes.
[i] and then Mamou. And then again to Conakry in the Bambeto district, right?
[r] Yes, exactly.
[i] Yes. How was that now, for example, there is a holiday season. Where did you spend that? And how was that about your parents? Maybe they tell us something? How are your parents?
[r] Yes, my parents, so my father comes from Labe. This is a city in where, let’s say, in Guinea, we have many ethnic groups. The Fulani, mostly, i.e., come from Labe. And there is a region, so there are four large regions. And as I said, my father comes from Labe. And my mother comes from Pita. My father’s parents, for example my grandma, on the father’s side, unfortunately I didn’t get to know them because it died when I was still very young. And my grandfather is actually, then with us, my father got him with us. Because in Guinea it is so when the parents get older, the children get their parents to themselves so that they take care of their parents. So unfortunately we couldn’t spend our vacation in Labe because the grandpa was already at home. And motherly side, my grandparents, they lived a carrier. This is a quarter in Conakry. And we were often on vacation, we were often there. My grandpa, motherly side, was a soldier. He served in Angola, while this, as is called freedom, i.e. fight.
[i] Independence.
[r] Yes, independence, fight, i.e. in Angola. And in Guinea-Bissau too, so served.
[i] How did your father?
[r] No, my grandfather.
[i] paternal side?
[r] No, mother’s side.
[i] from Pita?
[r] Yes, from Pita. But he lived in Conakry. So as I said, it was in carrier. So unfortunately I couldn’t know a different region in Guinea better, except for Conakry. I almost had everything in Conakry. I was once in ivory coast, with my brother to an uncle, so …
[i] Côte d’Ivoire, that’s …
[r] Côte d’Ivoire, yes exactly. For a month vacation. That was when we ours, as is called, in 10th grade …
[i] So, tires, not mature, but this degree …
[r] Yes, exactly when we …
[i] the 10th grade ended. Yes, exactly when we ended the 10th grade, we went there for a month.
[i] Was that a reward?
[r] um … You can say that because the uncle wanted to get us and my father said that he worked well for the 10th grade because the 10th grade in Guinea is the case, you do it according to region, for example the whole region Conakry, you deliver the results for Conakry and we were well positioned at this time, so we had good grades. Yes, and that’s why we had good as some, so he made this trip possible for us.
[i] Maybe I don’t know, memorabilia, can you tell us that it has and did you bring something where you say, do I remember that when I see it?
[r] Now they mean pieces … pieces, places or …
[i] You have a souvenir, don’t you have ready now?
[r] No, unfortunately not, unfortunately not.
[i] Now maybe the childhood dream.
[r] Yes, when I was still at school, my big dream was to be astronaut.
[i] Okay.
[r] Yes, I had this wish. As I said, I really got good school training. But unfortunately the quality of the universities in Guinea was not what I expected. That was a big disappointment. When I reached the 10th grade, I already understood that I can never be astronaut in Guinea. Unfortunately a dream was gone. And during this time, I hadn’t thought to leave the country to study somewhere else. But after that I really wanted to have a good training as an engineer. That is why this trip actually came to Germany.
[i] engineer. Would you have done something craftsmanship? Or what was your role model in the direction of engineer? So my will was actually a mechanical engineer. But I wasn’t good for technical drawing. That was when I came here, so I really wanted to study mechanical engineering. But when I looked at the program, There was technical drawing. And I thought So I will find it difficult to do with it. And then I chose electrical engineering. This is also a comparable direction. And during this time, Aachen too, Had received the MENTION ELITE University in the direction of electrical engineering and mechanical engineering. Then I thought Yes, that would also be a challenge. Yes, exactly.
[i] Yes. Still back to the Guinea, her childhood, youth. Are there places they say Where do you combine beautiful memories or bad memories?
[r] beautiful memories … there was one, what is that called, A small river in Conakry. That is near … The place was called Kakimbo. We had a small river there. We often went swimming. So that was free bathroom. There were many, as that means Fruit nearby. For example, let’s say, mangoes. And we have …
[i] […]
[r] Yes, exactly. We also had a lot of fruits. Yes, fruits. And let’s say … It was actually a place where we as a child filled ourselves freely in a world. Because there we had no adult who told us, do this, do it. That was our world.
[i] without rules.
[r] without rules. Yes, exactly. Without worry. So that was really our world. That was pure fun. And the other was football. Otherwise… Unfortunately it is not like here where children have such places, Where they can, as is called, can go play. In Guinea, we had football. Or, as I said, this swimming. Every now and then we were also to the sea because. .. Conakry, the sea is now around and around. So, we often went there and came to … to receive. Or we were sitting fishing in the evening. And we have that as … Children too. And together, a group, i. e. put and cooked, ate. That was also a . . . A nice memory. But the whole thing without adults nearby.
[i] Okay. Yes. You now also spoke of . . . from their parents. The upbringing. How would you . .. See retrospectively today?
[r] So I’m …
[i] How did you feel that?
[r] Yes. I grew up in a quarter where there were many offenses. Let’s say many young people … The possibility to simply take drugs. And crime was a bit high too. In this quarter Bambeto and Hamdallaye. And I would say if my father weren’t such a strict guy, I don’t think I’m somehow here … should or … could set. Or could even have an apprenticeship. Because… The only one, so I would say if you are a child, you don’t know what good or . .. I don’t know. What is bad for itself. But you just do a lot of things because friends did it. I would say, but in this matter … my father was very strict. He really has us … let’s say how one … it was like in the army. Actually. That was a military education. On his side. Our mother, on the other hand, was very nice. It was always the … The … let’s say was very strange. Everything done with love. But with the father … you should … you should … Bring results at school. You should be correct and … yes. But I’m … I am also very, very, very proud … But today. Because without this … we say without his strictness … We wouldn’t be here today. Me and my brother. I do not believe that. That helped us a lot.
[i] That means … You also have with other children … so your age … played together.
[r] Yes.
[i] Were there people who were super bad? Where they say …
[r] yes, unfortunately … unfortunately there were in this quarter … Many people who were very poor. We had neighbors who have … let’s say only once a day. Some but had hardly eaten during the day. That was really sad. But there was always, as I said … this is in Africa … there was always the possibility … For example, if we at home … had enough … we always shared. Or when we came back to school … So then we are … we called a few friends … so that they come to eat with us. Because that was also possible. So that was possible. We actually knew each other among friends. We knew the some who have nothing to eat. So we could … go and say … Come on, I’ll eat now. I would like you to eat with me. And you also liked that … they also liked … so participated.
[i] You also said … as far as this area is concerned … that there were many crime.
[r] Yes. Were there setbacks? Or people who then lost? That you made this affected? Or did you not notice that much?
[r] but. I remember … before … I don’t know … two … So 1998 … and 2000 … There were these clans … so … In Conakry … That … they were really … so … There were too many clans. Let’s say … even in this quarter … that means youth … So fight young people … against others … with mesh … and … what’s the name of … or knife … I even have … my own cousin … the lived … let’s say … 40 meters … from … my home … but … And … he … with him … you have him … that … so the hand … almost … so … taken away … Because when you … with a stitch … so beat … only … what your hand … So held … was … This skin here … that means … too close … he was … somehow … um … Could he … have a paralysia … but … thank God … yes … exactly … he became … again … And there were still … many … many … so … the … that in this thing … so … unfortunately… Unfortunately … um … I knew … I knew … two people who died from it … yes … uh … they were beaten … From other boys … uh … as he says … with um … mesh … or knife … are unfortunately … Have lost life
[i] was that more this always happened … during the day? At evening? Early?
[r] Can happen at any time … so … that’s actually … you see … uh … Youth from another quarter want … so … trouble with youth … from … for example … My neighborhood … that means … ok … we meet somewhere here … and … We beat ourselves or they just come to you … If the older person … Or … no idea … uh … No matter who they meet … ok … Then he will have trouble … that means … The person should … So … uh … Either hide … or… swear … that was … that … the … the possibility …
[i] The languages ​​also from religion … how, what value … Or what position had this religion washed in its upbringing?
[r] So religion had … I would even say that it was a top priority. My father is religious, he is even imam, now an imam.
[i] role models.
[r] Yes, exactly, role models there. That means we became in this religion, as it means, we grew up and that was actually, we should build the prayer, the five times prayer a day. We shouldn’t lie, not, as is called, don’t steal. Everything this religion forbid. That was also a ban with us. For example, we couldn’t say, let’s say, girls or something because it was forbidden.
[i] Was that also 1 to 1 for the young people? Or was more to know that what was coming?
[r] Yes, something else is followed, but if we say it was said, but followed 1 to 1, no, that was not the case.
[i] Then you took tempest? Yes, yes, exactly, exactly, in front of the parents, that was nothing to do, nobody should see something like that, that is, that is, so you live your religion according to his understanding, I would say yes. But the religion was very present in my life, in my childhood.
[i] Ok. Conakry, Guinea? Yes. What did you notice? So, as an unrest at the time, it was always the case, either the arms were not satisfied, or what does that mean that the students or the students could not, i.e., in good time with school or university. That was also a problem because there was a lack of teachers or, as it was called, the teachers were not, so, paid or in time, so, so, so, so, so. That was also a different problem, or political things, they still gave, all of this was noticed. Otherwise we say, I know the people there, so there was always peace. That means there were no ethnicity, we say, conflicts or Religious conflicts, no, there is no such thing in Guinea.
[i] Yes, but still this ethnic split is in Guinea, So, I very often hear about it, they say that there is no.
[r] No, I didn’t exist, I would say.
[i] Ok.
[r] Yes, now it has actually been since 2010, unfortunately, the politicians with us Having every politician uses his ethnicity to get to the market. The current president used this as his work, such as a magical work, i.e. Total population, so now that if you want a good post in Guinea, Then you have to have at least one name that somehow belongs to his ethnicity. Or as you can see, for example, there was always, as is that called, a revision of The opposition, but so far, I think more than 100 young people killed, without so far that one of this perpetrator …
[i] without an investigation.
[r] Yes, without an investigation, so far. Unfortunately, that’s the case. And if you see, all of these youth have, as is called Sinfulani, I would say. That means they have names like Dialo, BA, Bari, that is, they belong to the ethnicity of the opposition. So you can see that actually, there is already a huge one Division, but unfortunately, this is brought to action by the politicians.
[i] Now it is also the case that you just said that with the education that they were not satisfied.
[r] Yes. Exactly. What does that do? Is that of course a comparison, which you then compared with others? Or how did they get? I mean, they are born there and they get tasks that they didn’t know yet and then at some point they made it.
[r] So …
[i] Then they had more contact with abroad and a different claim. So, when I still say, we say when I was at the university in Guinea, that was from 2002 to 2006, that was still not the same in Guinea. So, that was not a tool that is said, ok, we use it often or … At that time it was only open to open e-mails, i.e. to read this. But at least when I did my high school diploma, I had a lot of friends who immediately flown to abroad for studying. That means you were always in contact with them and they always said what training you can get in these countries and how … So there are opportunities so that you can develop. And in Guinea, I remember when I started at the university, our professors always came from Russia. And the first thing that was people who hardly spoke French. So they have … So, they made an effort, but you couldn’t understand them, right. That was a problem and they always came too late. If I say too late, that is, the government was unable to pay these people on the rest so that they can come to Guinea on the rest to make the lectures. Therefore, we mostly studied six months, a maximum of eight months a year. That was actually very little for me compared to the friends who told me who had been abroad before.
[i] But now to the role of man-woman. How did they see it? So, with us that was the case, the father was the head of the family. So what he said was law. And the mother was second in the family. So, in Guinea, we are actually created. The man has more responsibility than the woman. And the upbringing also went that way. So, I heard that you always say to my sister when you are married at some point, you have to … So, hear, follow him, support, of course. But never, as he says, be loud on him. Or never, so, say that you … So, this, let’s say this man-woman justice, I do not do justice, indifference, you don’t actually see that. The man is always … Yes, so, the boss and the woman, i.e., follow, we say. So we were brought there, back then.
[i] But the upbringing, they said, how was that in everyday life? Did you spend more time with the mother?
[r] Yes.
[i] or more … exactly. So, my father worked, let’s say, from seven, so until evening at eight, nineteen. From how he was quickly used to at home. And my mother had only worked until fourteen. That means when I always came back to school, I found my mother at home, so. So I was able to spend more time with her, i.e. my father. My father at the weekend, the time what I spend with him was always on weekends. That was so. Because he works all day during the week. When he got home, then he always asked, did you do your housework? And how was it at school, things like that. Have you been in the Korean school? And were you good at your mother, things like that, so.
[i] So that means that the mother coordinated all of this?
[r] Yes.
[i] everything accompanied, quasi?
[r] Yes, exactly.
[i] And her father asked how it was?
[r] Yes, exactly. That was exactly.
[i] and on weekends? At the weekend he was at home and we often greeted families at the weekend. Or if, for example, there was a family party, then we did it with him. Of course with my mother too, but he was there too. Yes.
[i] to the rituals in Guinea. Is there anything where you say, yes, that is part of culture?
[r] rituals? I would say, for example, so …
[i] man, woman?
[r] Yes, for example, I would take it with the youth. If you do, what’s the name of? has reached some age, then … So you are cut and there was a … yes, exactly. For men. There was a kind of celebration where the whole family, the big family, i.e. found and cooked. And a kind of … The boy was then celebrated as a man. So because he is now this stage …
[i] position.
[r] Yes, this stage, not the maturity, but because he has now become a man. I mean when he was cut, then you say, okay, he is now a man. They give him money. You always got money from the parents from the family. I found that a nice tradition, which unfortunately can no longer be seen these days. Or what does that mean? There was another celebration, we call it Soroyamba.
[i] Okay.
[r] Yes, that’s such a solemn … A night celebration, where children are like Halloween here with you. So I mean here in Germany. That means you go to the neighbors or others and work and sing some song. And then you get money or something to eat as a child. That was something nice. But unfortunately, there is no longer anything like that.
[i] and this description … Then was there something that you also convey to you? The whole meaning that all of this has?
[r] Yes, exactly. There were words that were really conveyed. For example, we should, let’s say, at this point, okay, nothing more … You should behave like a man now. That means you should be aware and you should always say, we say, thank you what you have. Not as much as that means, let’s say, not the others … For example, if the parents didn’t have enough, you shouldn’t push them as much on hand. And when asked, for example, look, my neighbor gave it to his child. Should it exist for me? Or words like, for example, you should always be loyal to the family. You should always be good with older people. You should never scold older people, no matter what.
[i] in any form.
[r] Yes, exactly. As is called, one should always be respectful to the others. Such words were always conveyed, that is, that day. That you should always support your family, no matter what it should cost. Such words. Yes.
[i] and friendships, love?
[r] Yes, friendships, so friends, as I said.
[i] Except, I mean, your twin brother.
[r] No, no, yes, I really had friends when I was in 13th grade. In Guinea, we had done the high school diploma in the 13th grade. That means, so I could already give people who were in the lower class after help courses. That means, on this year, from this year, I could, as I, after I passed my ABI, of course, I was able to tutor, let’s say, to people who had prepared the ABIS. As a result, many contacts had been linked and had many friends. Because I was also in some schools where I also learned. And for example in, my father also has a school, a big school. I also gave lessons there, in mathematics. And besides, you also had many friends from the university, of course. And from the place where you grew up. And as I said, you had friends. This is a topic in Guinea, that’s a taboo. So you are things that you didn’t show openly at the time. Because there was, as is called an upbringing, the something like that, we said. That means you had always said, yes, this is a friend of school. But…
[i] But the real friend.
[r] Yes, yes, even though it was the real friend. That means that this is the only way to let it go. Otherwise it was difficult.
[i] Yes, still, we are in Guinea. Or did you tell … Exactly, everyday life. And I say briefly, in the morning, in the evening, what was actually what you did every day? That was different, let’s say when I was at school, for example. That was in the morning, that was school. I went to school with my brother.
[i] from Monday to Friday, right?
[r] Yes, exactly, from Monday to Friday.
[i] normal school?
[r] Normal school was.
[i] from how?
[r] From the parents now, right?
[i] No.
[r] So, yes, the school was always from 8 a.m. to 3:30 p.m. No, no, we had a break, an hour’s break. And two small breaks in between. We always had a break until 12 noon.
[i] lunch break …
[r] Yes, exactly, then from 12 p.m. to 1 a.m. we had a break. And then we started again at 1 a.m. So, and after school, then there was the Koranian school. That was also an obligation that we would go. After the Koranian school, we had from that time to the evening, we had a small window to play. We played football most of the time. Me and my brother, we were really good. After this game, then we came back home, showered. And then, there were still homework to be done. You made it. We were already to bed at 9 a.m. at 9 a.m.
[i] Maybe such a memory. Here, for example, there are young people or children that you have read something. Was there anything similar? I don’t remember that. But as I said, my parents helped to read books, make a reading. You helped that. But not like here, where you are in bed and the parents read a story to him. No, I don’t have that. Such a memory, no.
[i] Many are telling that they are told very fabulous stories by their parents.
[r] We got this kind of stories more from the big parents. Because we have big parents like friends. Real friends. They had always told us stories about our forefathers. And our place in Labi. So how the fulani actually came to Kenya. Who was our forefathers? And we have such stories. And there was still a show that I think had also run on Friday evening. The thing is called Tarika. The consequence. Where you then told small stories. About fairy tales. No, they were fairy tales in the evening.
[i] fairy tale stories.
[r] Yes, exactly. He was called from Amadou Sow back then.
[i] A very famous man.
[r] Yes, a very famous man. Which was very eloquent. Had told such stories. But of course stories that always had to do with an upbringing. Or colors, you can also say. These were such stories. Otherwise there were actually … My day was actually like that. And again. He is to school the next day. But when I came at the university, the ropes changed. So I could stay awake. As long as…
[i] You no longer believed in Santa Claus.
[r] at … with us in Guinea … in Guinea it is so, the country is more Muslim than Greek.
[i] No, I mean in the university, of course. The view is different.
[r] Yes, exactly, exactly.
[i] Okay, I mean.
[r] Yes, okay, okay. Sorry that I have interrupted them. I would still be interested in how it is with the … When conflicts gave, how were conflicts solved?
[r] Do you mean in the family now, right?
[i] Yes, how did you perceive that?
[r] So if you are actually a child, Then you don’t get much of conflicts within the family, we say. But if you are big, then do it. But in Guinea, as I said, the upbringing is so that no matter what happens in the family, The father is always right, we say. That’s why the family always teamed up and said to the mother You should be patient Maybe with a big heart, Take everything and do it, do everything, to avoid conflicts. It was always so solved.
[i] pastor.
[r] Yes, exactly. That was always like that. Yes.
[i] Yes, um … Now it will be in Guinea. Um, exactly. Socially. There was something where they … That was right. The society, I mean now. People, deal with each other, in the sense of … so, the government. How do you have this socially?
[r] Yes, society is a very healthy society, I would say because … that this legal process was. That means you got along correctly with others, even though you didn’t get from the same place. As I said, everything was not going well, was actually political things. Otherwise… The people, shooting, that was actually perfect. You always helped your neighbors as soon as you could. And also taken help, if you needed it. That was a healthy society.
[i] That means neighbors in Guinea were for them … My neighbors were like my brothers for me, actually I would say. They belonged to the family. That’s how it is in Guinea. The neighbor, the son of the neighbors, is automatically your brother. That’s how you actually see it. And that is just as directly your uncle. Although your father or he, your father and he not from the same place, or they are not part of the same family, but. Yes, exactly. It will automatically be an uncle for you.
[i] Yes. Now in Guinea, life perspective, there may be motifs to this story. They said that they just … your future not … so not … The future saw rosy in Guinea. And there you can tell us more. The motifs and …
[r] So …
[i] Who did something so that it all goes through it successfully. And the planning, I mean. Are you … the implementation? So, as I said, The motivation was I had a good training So school training, as I said. And that means If you have a good high school diploma, you expect you to visit a good university. And if you come to university now and notice, okay, me. I had already learned everything I learn here. That means You sit down and say OK, Something is wrong here. Or lazy. And because … an anecdote in the evening, I even didn’t go to university But when we … went to the clause, Then I had good grades. And… I myself started saying myself This is not the right training So that I wanted. And then, My father too, It was the same in this view. And my mother too. Then we sat down. We looked How can you do so that I. So, and my brother so that we have a good training. But there is still one thing to be explained. In Guinea, not all facilities are bad. For example in medicine, you study well. Really in Guinea. Because we even have Foreign students from Cameroon, Ghana, Elephant mountain coast, who go to Guinea, to study medicine. So the medical university is good, actually. But what is about engineering was not good.
[i] is good or was good?
[r] was … Yes. I’m talking…
[i] is average speaking …
[r] Okay, okay. Was good, I’ll say. I’m talking when I … Back when I was still there. So my brother, so he had studied medicine. Everything went well with him, actually. The studied well. But with me that was engineering … The course was really not good. And that’s why we sat down and my parents then said, try about the cooperation, when you wanted to study to France to go to go. And then, as I said, about this friend of my father, who studied here in Germany, so he studied in Bremen and he told us about studying in Germany and then I have, with the initiative, of course with my father’s initiative, then of course we sent applications to Lyon, I still remember in France. Aachen was that. There were still Bremen, I think. There were still Saint-Étienne.
[i] in France, right?
[r] Yes, exactly.
[i] Different …
[r] Yes, exactly. And then Aachen replied first. So when the answer came that, as is called 7000 euros, about the same way, one should in an account here in Germany, i. e. transfer or block so that that is at least enough for the first year. And my parents with the family, everyone gave what they could so that I can come here. And that was a great help for me. And when I came here I could already do for the first year Without, what does that mean Difficulties with the, to start at least with the language.
[i] then flew alone Or with other students too?
[r] I am with another student who was called [name], [name] he was called, that should actually go he should fly to Bremen And I go to Aachen. We are together So we flew over Brussels Airlines. That means, We took the flight from Conakry to Brussels.
[i] Direct flight?
[r] Yes, direct flight. And then from Brussels, I have my little brother My mother lives there He studied there.
[i] Your uncle?
[r] Yes, my uncle, exactly. He studied there and works there and also had his family there. Then he got us from the airport We had breakfast with him. We are, I think at six o’clock or seven o’clock in Brussels. And after breakfast, then he took care of one or two tickets in Thalys around eleven o’clock.
[i] Yes, these are the train, the French Train?
[r] Yes, exactly, exactly. So then we took the Thalys exactly. Taken from Brussels to Aachen. A few friends awaited us there who already came here. And yes, they brought us to that.
[i] Okay. I want to go back a little again. When they knew here we go, What came in the head What kind of thoughts did you really have?
[r] So when I …
[i] So, at the beginning okay, you may have the necessary, Bureaucracy hurdles. And as when it was clear, Okay, everything is okay now.
[r] yes, as my visa even, uh, so given by the authorities, During this time, as in Guinea, there was As I said in Guinea, there was unrest. That was in 2007. In early 2007. It was unrest, so that was somehow, It was difficult to move I would say. Because there was always what’s it called, Unrest on the streets and everything. So my visa came I only knew it a month later. I didn’t even know that because I had the opportunity to To the message, I had this opportunity to go to the message. I didn’t have it because the streets were, blocked, and everything. And, uh, then I got a call from, from, from message, there, of course from the German message. Then you told me that your visa is here, yes, you have an approval that you can now fly to Germany to study. Then, I have, I, so, um, that, I said that to my father. And, well, actually that day, I already have it, because, um, If you already open Preparation, before, for a trip, OK? You grab it not really, as soon as you don’t have the visa yet. But, at the point where you have the visa, then you think, Oh, Now I will leave my parents. I will, so, leave my surroundings. I will have to know something new, what I don’t at all, so, before, before, Let’s say where I have no idea. I will go somewhere where I don’t know the culture do not know people. Then you get, somehow, a fear. But, anyway, Is you also proud The country, somehow, to leave. to leave for, A further education. Because you say OK, My parents did it for me. Because, it not all who have this option.
[i] So speak of the pool and, push factors.
[r] Yes, exactly. Um, me, maybe i mean, How was that now I know, The gears, The approval is there. That comes to one So, right …
[r] as I said, right, I was afraid. Get really scared.
[i] fear of what, what? So, fear, from, This, so, idea because, I already knew now, I would be.
[i] from the separation? Or?
[r] That was one thing. But, the thing that scared me more, The idea that I will go somewhere now where I Neither the culture, nor the people, nor, as he says, Life here, know that was for me, The greatest fear, so, Because I didn’t know the language, even. That was for me, really, the one who The right fear because I thought Now when you go How will you do your life, actually? You, can’t speak German at all, And if there are people there, The French can speak, because, um, up to, Two days before my trip I still knew, no one who lived here in Germany. None. Then to two days before, Then, um, About contacts, somehow, then, then, one boy who also studied in Aachen, now works in Puppertal, comes from Guinea, who, um, had told me, who is in Aachen, and, for a year now that I shouldn’t worry, it is one thing that can be survived. That got me a bit, uh, yes, a little calms down. Otherwise, the fear was there.
[i] And, yes, to the, virtue factors, yes, what, what has, what did it get dressed, do you say? Yes, that’s why. I mean this fear There is a kind of balance on the one hand fear, On the other hand, hope.
[r] Yes, hope was for me The hope was for me because I had, then, after, after, so, so, During this application time, I had informed myself About your studies, here in Germany. And that was when I then, at that time, had read Germany was I mean with England, During this time, one, Had, one of the best universities here in Europe. And then, I also saw that Aachen, was an elite university. I thought that that, I could already have what I always wanted, that, this good education. Because it was always a dream for me. And, even, I had seen that, here, in Germany, the opportunity also had to study astronomy, Although I then no longer, So, at, for me came to the question. But, this, i.e. um, know that I, here, are well trained, can, that was right, then moved on. And, this fear, So, um, Let’s say um, will not say, survive, but simply, uh, looked through.
[i] maybe now, sometimes, with the perspective, They are now increasing Did you fly earlier?
[r] How please?
[i] on plane.
[r] yes, yes, uh, yes, I was already When I follow, uh …
[i] Ivory coast. Exactly, exactly, I had already flown there, yes.
[i] But that’s not that far, isn’t it?
[r] No, no, that was, I think 45 minutes flight, yes.
[i] And how was this trip to Europe? So how do you feel if you, start with the plane, and then, How, how did it feel?
[r] Yes, as I said, with, with, with me, The fear is only at the start, actually. I have, that’s I’m still afraid, still because If you look so many documentary In the evening, times, uh, There are still things in the head. So I know that I already knew that the greatest dangers on the plane were, starting and landing. And when I start I always have this, you have the feeling that, one, so, uh, one of the other the blood somehow, everything pulls and something like that These attraction effects. So, um, that was that, that, That was actually the only fear, so The only fear for me.
[i] Was that in the evening or during the day?
[r] no, I am, so The departures to Europe, If you, so, there were only two companies during this time, which somehow flew to Europe. That was Brussels Airlines and Air France. And they are all flown, i.e. from [name] 45, i.e.. That means, That was like that in the evening.
[i] in the evening.
[r] Yes. At evening. And then you landed here, so, tomorrow morning.
[i] and then? I imagine Conakry very warm, I know. Yes, Is yes That was, Africa is warm, and then? It was, that was the shock because I am, I am here in April.
[i] April, okay.
[r] April, so, um, I had a suit, without a jacket, um, because, um, yes, as I said, in Guinea, I had never worn a sweater, so you hear, how is the cold in Europe, but you, I, I know it, you didn’t know if I say it. And then, yes, I also had no right idea, of it, I always saw people with jackets and everything on TV, but I didn’t know what they felt during this time. And then, um, as I, ie, um, where you, the ones, the ones who, those who, the police, i. e., ie, the police, the police, i. e., passed,
[i] customs control
[r] yes, this customs control, i. e., for customs control, then I took mine, i.e. my, and then, I wanted to see, as he says, uh, uh. And then, I came, near the door, I wasn’t outside, I was near the door, then such a cold air, so, welcomed me that I ran away again, and somewhere, uh, uh,. And then I immediately called my uncle, I told him, please come with a super thick jacket because, otherwise I won’t go out of here. And, during this time when I took the train, and came to Aachen, so I found all friends who had T-shirts, and as he says, shorts.
[i] I assume that’s Summer time, then, right?
[r] Yes, that was April, So, I think on the 17th For example, that’s how it was.
[i] Okay.
[r] and I had my big jacket, I asked myself How can you wear something now, me? But now, with getting used to it, So, with the years, you get used to it.
[i] And, yes, Africa, Guinea, I also did the weather. Your first impression when she, Germany, have entered, or when they came to Germany, in Germany, Your first impression?
[r] First impression was the order. That was the order. And the cleanliness. Yes, That was my first impression. It was clean everywhere. And, As I said, this order. So because, When I came I believe, Two weeks later, I rented an apartment. And, uh, this, what’s it called, Uh, I mean, if I say now, the cleanliness, that is on the streets, not on the one because, at home, with everyone it is clean. But, I mean now, the streets, the order that you can, not, i. e., so, so you can cross as long as they are not green. And that, as is called, uh, garbage, so on the streets, you can’t let it go. Such things really impressed me. Because, even, in France, I saw, I think that people were different on TV. So, Let’s say Things on the streets Thrown, and something. When I was still in Belgium My first day, Had a small round with my uncle, but, there too, This impression What I got here, so, in Germany, the, I also had that in Belgium, not there either. Because, we went to a place that day, was called Matombo, In Brussels, It was exactly like in Guinea.
[i] in West Africa.
[r] Yes, exactly. And that, Yes, it is called West Africa, yes, exactly, in Brussels.
[i] Okay.
[r] Yes.
[i] and your experience with language?
[r] So when I came here, then two weeks, After two weeks, I should start with the language. I have with me uh, b1, uh, A1, A1 started. And then, uh, At this time there was What was called fellow students. That was…
[i] That still exists.
[r] Okay. Because, that has already been abolished, in Aachen.
[i] ah.
[r] Yes. And that was a year, i.e. training, for preparation, to the university. So, uh, you should take a test beforehand to get them, i. e. the approval, to, to attend this school, or, this preparation year. And, you should know a little German beforehand. And then I have, a, um, What does that mean, three months, what is called, German briefly, at the university of applied sciences, in Aachen, was, at that time, in Bayernallee, that was, um, but, these three months, I would not have been enough to pass this test, so. Because, when we came, we were like that, I think about six or eight boys from China, who did the test, i. e., I was the only one who passed the test during this time. I also had exactly 60 points. You should actually have 60 points, and, also of 100, to pass the test, i.e.. And then I had exactly 60, but a man, before, helped me, that was a, big brother, who comes from China, also, also called [name], was a, then a student, in Aachen, on the Efeta, as he says, um, studied. And, when I came, he took me to his protection, and,, in these, as he says, three months, a lot, a lot helped, a lot, So because, he talked to me, only in German, and gave me too many so, Tasks to do, To prepare me, so, for the test. That, really helped me. That was, let’s say the way, to this, to the study college. And, I did a year Where we then, math, physics, Chemistry and German. But, as I said, Math, physics, chemistry, was for me, one, purely nothing because, I already had at school, there, I had already visited university, that was Actually, I should only The words in German, so, learn, How to do such things, speak in German.
[i] okay, the experience, With people, I now, with one from Guinea, too, Now tells, with the Germans, was there an income?
[r] yes, when I came There were uh, There is one What does that mean, an evangelical, what is that called, community, a community, a Protestant, community in Aachen. ISG means when I started, with the colleague, they have such an apartment, for students, then I went there, so, and, and, I used to do, which, actually, for my first years, there, for the study, a lot, say, say, financially, and still, we, in the direction of parlor, small, as is called, training, or, so, so, so, so, so It was actually about life here in Germany. There was the woman [name], called that back then She also had me, really to, to your, so, uh, as is that called Protection taken, and, uh, I also had the opportunity to get to know many German students, Because only students lived there. We were there uh, I think that was 54 rooms, Or there were 50 rooms, then. We always sat down at the beginning of the semester, so, Laws for the house together, so, made, and there was always every Thursday, there was a um, a celebration, So, we had our own club, in the house, so, so, People have always gone So, drink something together, and, There was also the possibility We always have football there for example, World Cup, or, EU, uh, what’s it called, um, This squad, not in Africa, yes, how is it, championship too, or, European championship, also cooked together, And we also had uh, In this house you should also do gardening, that is, for everyone who lived there That too, was also an opportunity Where people met After gardening, have cooked together have eaten together, And there was always For example, in, Christmas, or, no, not Christmas, but, Halloween, or something, there was always, chocolates, so, before the, in front of every door, from the ISG, of course, that was, that was really, um, a place where you could, so, friendship, bind.
[i] Yes, we have that about the living situation, and, the integration that was carried out there, perhaps, maybe, about the expectation. How did you, before you came, did you have expectation reality?
[r] expectation, actually, If you are in Guinea, you have another, View, over Europe. You think, okay when I end up here, Then I’ll be on the street Money, so can collect, Or, every third that I meet gives me 100 euros, life is simple, After a year, I’ll be myself, can buy my house, or, somehow, can buy a Porsche. That is, actually, the view that we, in Guinea, had Actually when I was there. And, if you end up here, then you notice that, Life is totally, different, So that, For every penny, you should, Fight yourself, for that. That means, Nobody gives them a cent, somehow Or 10 euros, or something. One should, so, so, Work for every thing, yourself. And, of course, these were Such things, If, if, I remember when you are in Guinea, most, so, get things from the parents, and you are not used to working. And also, suddenly, you can even go to work here, in winter, and things like that. It was a challenge.
[i] as you said, so with the family contacts?
[r] Yes, with family contact, at that time, there was, as I said, the internet was not that, it was not that, And there was still all of these, as is that called, There was Facebook, Messenger, Or, everything, What you use here today, Whatsapp, These occasions, gave, then not. So, I think until 2011, Something like that, it was not. That is, one, I always had on the weekend, Or in the evening, When I came back from the university There is a shop, in Aachen, Aachen, At Aachen Bus station, there, a That was one An Indian, or, we will say one, uh, an Arabic, somehow, Shop, A call center where you could call, and, I always went there Have my parents so, called, and, 10 minutes, 20 minutes with them, so, um, talked, or, you had also bought a card, A SIM card, And that charged, so that you can do with the parents, i.e. could come into communication.
[i] okay, and what about everyday life, Why so that this happened from Guinea, in Germany, your everyday life?
[r] yes, my everyday life, so when I started at the university, I think that first year, I think the first year, was like that, um, so, After the university, We always came how is that, to the library, because in Aachen it is so The library is also at the center of the university. That means you go in there, get out, go to the other row. So, it was like that, until evening, because the university had until 0 a. m., and, otherwise, and otherwise, uh, on, in the evening you played football here, when I came here, I already had, in Wals that was, um, uh, I had already played football, and I even remembered, but I even got money for it, but the parents said, but the parents said, Yes, I should study, don’t play football, and then I concentrated on my studies, so, so. That means in dormitory, where I, i. e., in the, at the ESG, we had many, as is called, um, many activities that we, i. e. did together, had to do it together. Therefore, that was, i.e., studies, parties, in the evening, friends, joy with friends, or, what does that mean, surroundings, from, from home, so, so that. So, on the weekend, I came to Cologne in the evening, or to Düsseldorf, depending on whether I had something to do in the evening or not. But otherwise, there was, work, also, work because I should, what is called, itself, um, my things. That means you were, I was on the, I had one, as is called, part -time job. In the beginning, it was the case that I had worked during the holidays because I had a month and something where you had taken a full -time job. Or, as is that called, um, During my studies, I had one, I had the opportunity at the university to work for two years at the university, as, hiwi job, uh, As a student assistant when they say. And, yes, You also learned a lot there and got money for it.
[i] Experience with democracy?
[r] Yes, that was always one thing and is still one thing so far. So if you extend your visa, That, at the beginning, had, so, you were always afraid because the conditions were So, you should have certain subjects, have managed to have managed to extend his visa. That means, Or you should have enough money in your account to extend your visa. That was always my thumb much So that means, in the evening, If you had difficulties, so I mean, one, so much money together, around, Get at least one year or two years. But, my own experience, I have, let’s say, hm, I’m not with me, I mean I had no difficulty with bureaucracy I would say. Because when I came here I asked my uncle that he, for me, an obligation, removal, somehow power, So that I A little, a little rest with these account statements. Because, I knew many who then every time, You should have over 2,000 euros in your account, to get an extension. And that was always difficult, as I said, because the foreign students, yes, mostly, everyone, I will say, I have to work to finance his studies themselves.
[i] but not only the foreign, also the Germans.
[r] Yes, but those who have access to the Bafög, or something. That is a relief. But that we don’t have.
[i] Now to the city. Culture, leisure, people.
[r] yes, um, to the city, um, I would say me have taken part in many rooms. Or, as that means, there was one, a Cameroonian, as is called, community in Aachen. They had also been many with the city of Aachen. I also had participated. But otherwise, some projects, or something, I have not yet done with the city. But there are still things that have to come like that, i. e. now, for me, so, so.
[i] and with the Germans?
[r] yes, with the Germans, As I said, I have uh, I had contacts, so from the university, And, from the, from, From the dorm. And these contacts have still remained, so, They write us once in the evening when something gives. Meet us too, once in the evening. But, now it’s not like before. Because everyone is Some are in other cities, and, but, That means, You don’t drift so often.
[i] They also told that you just here Get to know people from Guinea. How, is the community from Guinea here, after your consideration? Or how important is the community for you? Yes, for me it is very much for me very important, I only come, there was lately, Many young people who have come here who really needed help, have, So, in Cologne, for example, I had I have a friend We lived together, and, at this time, and, we had the initiative, i. e. to help this youth, to give directives, what they can do here, so best, but what I think is a bit of a shame, the Guinea community is not organized, how the Cameroonian, where, every, say, help, from, his community, can have, or, I think . ..
[i] […]
[r] Yes, exactly, it, there are no structures, here, which, one, somehow, so, so, Welcome, or can help something, unfortunately there is no.
[i] I mean that it would be very important, yes, right?
[r] Yes, I think, no, no, no, I think it would be very important to have such a structure, because, in the end, I read that the majority, from youth who apply here, asylum, come from Guinea, that is, it would be nice that a structure, from, a Guinean structure, give, that, actually, about, with the city, I will now, to this, to this, to this. Could take care of this youth, i. e., or at least, directive what the people, the people, have already experienced here, so that, this fresh, coming young people, make the same mistakes as, like one, for example. That would be …
[i] What do you think, what needs to be done so that you can get pasted there? So, I think you should sit down, first, and then, then, About, what does that mean Education, training, I mean, how to So, could manage projects, Or how to, for example, Life here, When we say Seminars on living together here, those where you like, like, Lectures could give So that these people The newcomers, so that they too What does that mean, one, One, can have information Because the biggest problem is here when you arrive here and no information, neither from city, still, from, from, can have from his people here, Because most are afraid to go to the city and ask something. And if there is no structure here which you, so familiar, or in which you are familiar, Then it will be difficult.
[i] How about the house shape in general in everyday life? There are contracts here You are, no Business, no, you are again 18, Can you conclude contracts and there, I don’t know, eh, You close something and then you want to undo something again, such difficulties. Did you experience something like that?
[r] yes, even with the telephony, contracts, That is, that’s one thing, or, Many go online, Click, something, Then they get, or, you can see, that any contracts, Where they have difficulties later to go out. There is a lot, me, me, I met a lot of people who told me such difficulties Where for, for example, did not understand the contract Or because they are not correct, for example, Can understand German, Something closed, But in the end, they are there they have to pay a lot of money Then the then have not prepared for this. That is…
[i] You also tell a lot Especially in North Rhine-Westphalia, so far a country, in, it is a place in Germany, Where people are very friendly.
[r] Yes.
[i] have this experience Or, what experience do you have with people from North Rhine-Westphalia?
[r] I will be honest in North Rhine-Westphalia, I have, it I will say that Many say that they At some point, here, somewhere in Germany, So have experienced racism. I will not say that in my case, I haven’t experienced yet. I only know uh, Maybe I’ll say there is, um, at, mostly, here, This, as is called, um, How could I express that um, The, so many, many don’t dare to do that much, for example, for example, because, we even have this, um, Thing in the head, many think Okay when someone is white he absolutely has to know a lot, as or, can, as, who does not have its color or skin color has This, as is that called, um, this thing, If many will experience here, I will say. But I personally have never experienced something like that. I was in once Berlin, there, I don’t know if I do that, can be called racism, i.e. But, a woman asked me there, So how were there, for the seminar, me and, a colleague, From work, And we were on, eating, In a restaurant, And then, she said Your, foreigner, you come here, Take our money, And, have a look, The, I will say it has, that is, the one who meant me, actually, actually, You eat good food here All something like that, but, yes, I ignored that because I know that I worked for the money, I was not given it And I studied, paid for it there are always, idiots, or, Such people who, ir community, Remember that he is not from here.
[i] so, something too Bochum, to the city, What bond, what experience do you have here, made in Bochum?
[r] yes, unfortunately, I’m not So, let’s say, so, Long, here, in Bochum, in Herne, I will say I am in Herne, since March, 2018, And, I worked in Cologne, that’s why, I went, always, so, tomorrow, 6 o’clock out, and came home, 9 p.m. That means, Everything I have experienced here, maybe, Christmas markets, I found that, beautiful, or, In the evening, times, on the weekend, swim, to go, But, that is also, in Herne, there, on Lago, I don’t know if you know the place But otherwise, I had experiences, more, in Aachen, There, I spent more, more, time, so.
[i] and, they have been living in Germany for several years.
[r] Yes.
[i] And, how do you look, the future? So, as I said, I have studied here, I hope that I can find a good job here, Where I, then, let’s say me, develop, could, but, what I, prefer, I mean, I come, from a country, Where, let’s say nothing, was done, In perspective, development, or, as is that called, It would be me, a wish that I, at some point, One, Connection, let’s say, my country, and Germany, in the direction of, let’s say, engineering, Where we then, for example, Many projects in Guinea, also, can build up, With support, of course, If it is possible, I mean this know-how, transfer, I would like that At some point, to Guinea.
[i] So, in Germany, now you are here, If you ask the question, home, Where is home? What is home to you? Yes, for me, home is where you are, Where you live And where you feel good. I mean, feel good means, so Where to work Where you have your tax pays where, so, we say, let’s say, no fraud, somehow, power, Or where you live a fair life, I would say. Work, integrate yourself, of course, The one who, um, the culture, And, as is that called, the, the mentality, or, life here, So, uh, accept, or, uh, I would say because it is It’s a shame that Very in the evening, many people come here And, they even give themselves the effort, To speak German, I think that’s a shame.
[i] and home, again, where is home? Is it guinea Is it Germany?
[r] I will say for me, now it is uh, That is a difficult question because, I’ve been living here for eleven years now This is actually …
[i] This is very well defined.
[r] Yes, that’s This is my home. So, actually, I, um because, the friends, The I in German, In Guinea, had There are friends of school And, the friends I have here now, I will say There are people The every day, my Ah, or, There are the people who take part in my everyday life, i.e.. That means, For me it is home here.
[i] I think he has become home.
[r] Yes.
[i] okay, me, You know, the following often come in my head, in Africa, In Guinea, there is Mostly, back black, natural, life, And if that If you then left there and come here That is exactly the other way around.
[r] Yes.
[i] How did you have it perceived, or, gave there or, Where did you say there, wow, right?
[r] the one, actually, I had this impression, only, I think, on the first, unit day, because, I think we were 300, about so, about so, about the fact, the faculty, uh, from electrical engineering, computer science, technology, computer science, at the RWTH Aachen, so, and, on the first semester, and, I was sitting there, looking at the right Only three blacks there, and, one, that, impressive because, because it is not a habit, during this time, But now, meanwhile, Is that to me Doesn’t matter, actually, Is it normal now to find me under white So, that, is quite normal, now, everyday life.
[i] Yes, I think you told us so much, and in time, everything is As we have Yes, her last word.
[r] yes, My last word would be um …
[i] the closing word.
[r] as I said, um, Place so many values ​​on this, i.e., know -how transfer. I hope that the people who come here that at some point you have the opportunity So what they learned here In the countries, so, again, um, To continue, I would say to bring or forward. That would be a way, too, For Germany, also, yourself, better, a market, In these, developing countries to make themselves. That would be my wish. Thank you very much.
[r] Yes, I thank you.
[i] I hope you have not, not strained or surprised.
[r] No, no, no, no.
[i] And, in this sense, thank you again.
[r] Yes, thank you very much.